Aquaponics Digest - Mon 01/10/00

 

Message 1: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
 from "Kevin Reed" 

Message 2: Chemicals, Genetics, or Not, A Poll.
 from Bill 

Message 3: Chemicals, Genetics, or Not, A Poll.
 from Bill 

Message 4: Pond Consrtuction Issues / Israel
 from Bill 

Message 5: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
 from "Mark Brotman" 

Message 6: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
 from William Evans 

Message 7: Re: Farm odors
 from CAVM

Message 8: Re: Farm odors
 from William Evans 

Message 9: Hello!
 from Doug Peckenpaugh 

Message10: EM (was Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique)
 from "Mark Brotman" 

Message11: UNSUBSCRIBE
 from robert 

Message12: Re: EM
 from CAVM

Message13: Re: EM
 from William Evans 

Message14: Re: EM (swine)
 from William Evans 

Message15: graPEfruit seed extract kills algae
 from William Evans 

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| Message 1 |
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Subject: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
From:"Kevin Reed" 
Date:Sun, 9 Jan 2000 21:11:49 +0200

Aloha,
Some here are using old used carpetwith jute as mulch in open fields (good
replacement for IBM burlap bags)... In open fields first a cover crop like
sun hemp, alfalfa, clover is planted to out compete weeds and add nitrogen
to the soil.Before the crop is planted the cover crop is mowed and covered
with carpet. It seems to hold down weeds better than cardboard or newspaper
or other material some have used. For composting or mulching piles I like
the ones they use in Bavaria ... cement bottoms with manure and carbon
source in a pile covered with plastic tarps that are weighted down with old
tires ... here again old carpet might work better as a cover. I don't know
of any good inoculants for compost piles but for open field rizobiums are
very necessary ( unless soil content is high enough) for nitrogen fixing
plants. I will try to find out about anaerobic inoculants for compost piles.
Aloha Nui Loa,
Kevin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta" 
To: aquaponics
Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2000 8:35 PM
Subject: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique

>
> > what I found....anthick insulating layer of burlap bags on top.. to
> > keep the compost composting.
> >I do this w a plastic tarp, but not very breatthable so must be removed
> > periodically to " stir".
>
> William,
> There are several long threads under the soil/compost forum and some
> more discussion in the organic gardening forum of gardenweb.com.
> Apparently burlap is important vs other covers because, in addition to
> providing darkness (which seems to make the soil microorganisms work
> overtime) the burlap allows the optimal amount of moisture in and there
> is a whole microflora that develops in the burlap fibers themselves.As
> to an innoculant, basically they say "if you build it they will come"
> but a handful of good "forest duff" from a nice leafy forest bed is
> supposed to jump-start things.There is no stirring necessary.

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| Message 2 |
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Subject: Chemicals, Genetics, or Not, A Poll.
From:Bill 
Date:10 Jan 00 00:11:53 PST

This addresses a little of the road-rage had recently.If it does not - =
via
its questions - open minds even a crack, perhaps it will allow them fruit=
ful
purpose.

Here is the address for you to participate in a Time Magazine poll on
genetically modified foods. If you have already participated in the
past, they have apparently restarted the poll because the old results
were contaminated. It takes two minutes at most.

http://www.pathfinder.com/time/daily/poll/0,2637,foodpoll2,00.html

Thanks to Marty Kraft of UrbanEco.
Bill

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| Message 3 |
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Subject: Chemicals, Genetics, or Not, A Poll.
From:Bill 
Date:10 Jan 00 00:11:53 PST

This addresses a little of the road-rage had recently.If it does not - =
via
its questions - open minds even a crack, perhaps it will allow them fruit=
ful
purpose.

Here is the address for you to participate in a Time Magazine poll on
genetically modified foods. If you have already participated in the
past, they have apparently restarted the poll because the old results
were contaminated. It takes two minutes at most.

http://www.pathfinder.com/time/daily/poll/0,2637,foodpoll2,00.html

Thanks to Marty Kraft of UrbanEco.
Bill

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| Message 4 |
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Subject: Pond Consrtuction Issues / Israel
From:Bill 
Date:10 Jan 00 00:31:55 PST

>Subject: Re: Fw: Greenwater Culture in Israel.
From:"Sam Levy" 
Date:Sat, 08 Jan 2000 05:26:30 PST
jim,
>sorry for the delay in posting--december was a crazy month.
for a 200 sq m concrete floor i would guess that 8 inches would be thick
enough--although you might be able to getaway with 6 inches.i would con=
sult
w/a construction engineer over depth and correct diameter reinforcements =
as i

sam
---
>?>From: "James Rakocy" 
>>Subject: Re: Fw: Greenwater Culture in Israel.

>>plan to build two circular greenwater tanks early next year.
They will be >200 m2. I would be interested to learn
>about construction techniques.>(45 degree slope made of
thicker lining material) in the center of the>tank. >The
other method will use a speed block wall and a concrete
bottom.I would like to know the best way to pour a
>200 m2 concrete floor.How thick should it be?What
type of reinforcing >is>best?There will be a 18 inch
wide by 1 foot deep footing around the>perimeter.
---
*
Maybe a sewage treatment contracter could help.This is a
standard Clarifier (often had with rotating arms to sweep
detritus sediment toward the center, very slowly, via a
'wiper') in the US, except a DAF is usually 10-15 feet
deep... but decreased loads would be easy for an
enginneer to guesstimate.your bnase the comcrete goes
on has something to do with it.I could use my standard
practices for pulic works Municipal wastewater industries
Construction, but local codes (if any) will vary too...

*Why (how) did you choose the perimeter footing?
(No need to reply...)It seems that ties the hands of
the designer of the rest of the 'floor.'

*You MAY not have this problem... but seepage holes are
placed every several feet, so the water in the soil
will not "float" and rupture the tank, when it is
occassionally emptied for cleaning.Depends on rain
and water table.Perhaps a nearby semi subterranium
pump room/box?A mixed blessing...

Interesting, best of fortune.
Would like to know How you decide,
almost more than What you decide.
Bill

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| Message 5 |
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Subject: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
From:"Mark Brotman" 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 10:55:54 -0500

Bill,

I've used EM (you referenced the site for the American distributor of this
Japanese product:http://209.153.214.27/prod02.htm).There are several
forms of it-- each its own community of microorganisms.The stuff I used was
very impressive-- highly accelerated microbial processes for both soil and
water, deodorization; and supposed to do a lot of other things too.But
Adriana is right on target (again)-- whether it's water or soil "build it and
they will come"-- you really needn't spend the money.If you'd rather not
wait though, EM would likely be an excellent innocculant, or it could be used
to (temporarily? long term?) turbo charge the bed.

MarkBrotman

Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta wrote:

> > what I found....anthick insulating layer of burlap bags on top.. to
> > keep the compost composting.
> >I do this w a plastic tarp, but not very breatthable so must be removed
> > periodically to " stir".
>
> William,
> There are several long threads under the soil/compost forum and some
> more discussion in the organic gardening forum of gardenweb.com.
> Apparently burlap is important vs other covers because, in addition to
> providing darkness (which seems to make the soil microorganisms work
> overtime) the burlap allows the optimal amount of moisture in and there
> is a whole microflora that develops in the burlap fibers themselves.As
> to an innoculant, basically they say "if you build it they will come"
> but a handful of good "forest duff" from a nice leafy forest bed is
> supposed to jump-start things.There is no stirring necessary.
>
> Adriana
>
> >Iwas thinking maybe that there was a special innoculant, something
> > like this
> > http://209.153.214.27/prod02.htm
> >But I was unable to find any mention of innoculant in the limited # of
> > posts that i was able to read on theis subject.
> > Id be intereste d in moreinfoanyone can glean from this.

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| Message 6 |
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Subject: Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique
From:William Evans 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 08:59:51 -0800

 I thinkwhatthe EM supplies is anaerobic 'digestors' , where normal
composting is primarily aerobic digestors. Where one has lots of "pit"
waste, I think this stuffexcels. I think that's their( im guseeing
here) primary customer... dairy/feedlot waste managers.
One local dairy pumps their waste lagoon wateronto surrounding
pasture...talk about smellin the farm be4 seein it!!!! phewww
 my guess is that they dont use this product.
bill

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| Message 7 |
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Subject: Re: Farm odors
From:CAVM
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 12:03:07 EST

In a message dated 1/10/2000 10:57:19 AM Central Standard Time, 
williamevans@home.com writes:

>One local dairy pumps their waste lagoon wateronto surrounding
>pasture...talk about smellin the farm be4 seein it!!!! phewww
> my guess is that they dont use this product.
>bill

Bill,

The lagoon effluent from a dairy does not have to announce the existence of 
the dairy to everybody driving by.There are plenty of economical and 
environmentally responsible ways to keep dairy and hog waste from smelling.
The same is true of the large poultry houses although the techniques are 
different.

Cornelius A. Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc

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| Message 8 |
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Subject: Re: Farm odors
From:William Evans 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 09:12:57 -0800

> The lagoon effluent from a dairy does not have to announce the existence of
> the dairy to everybody driving by.
 I kno, but but apparently the daairy does not..

There are plenty of economical and
> environmentally responsible ways to keep dairy and hog waste from smelling.
 exactly my beliefabout EM
bill

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| Message 9 |
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Subject: Hello!
From:Doug Peckenpaugh 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 10:36:53 -0800

My name is Doug and I'm the new editor of the hydroponics magazine, The
Growing Edge. I've been lurking in the shadows for the last month or so,
observing the group and learning more every day about this growing
field. And I want to learn more.

My question is: Does anyone know of a good, comprehensive printed
overview of aquaponics? I'm looking for a book that would cover the
basics for someone just getting into aquaponics. This list is great and
I look forward to reading it every day. However, I would like a book
that I could turn to whenever I have a basic question (and to recommend
to people who are interested in this field).

Thanks!

--Doug Peckenpaugh
(doug@growingedge.com)

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| Message 10|
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Subject: EM (was Re: New Interbay Mulch (IBM) composting technique)
From:"Mark Brotman" 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 13:46:27 -0500

It was about a year and a half ago that I was using the EM, but if memory
serves, EM is supposed to be a combination of over 80 aerobic, anaerobic
microbes and includes things like actinomycetes (sp?) and blue-green
algae.It was apparently more of a discovery than the result of a
concerted development process.In Japan, EM has been used for things like
purifying water to make it potable, to de-odorize dairy and poultry farms
in areas where the neighbors had been complaining, for farm soil
improvement and to speed up household composting.I can tell you from my
own observations that it does de-odorize marvelously well and will grow at
least some plants observably larger and faster in soil (specifically tried
it on taro, green onions, chinese cabbage).Have tried it in aquaponics
too, got about 10% more romaine lettuce but the effect went away after a
couple of months.I bet your local dairy could add this to their stream
with good effect on odor control.Maybe the neighbors would buy it for
them!

Mark

William Evans wrote:

>I thinkwhatthe EM supplies is anaerobic 'digestors' , where normal
> composting is primarily aerobic digestors. Where one has lots of "pit"
> waste, I think this stuffexcels. I think that's their( im guseeing
> here) primary customer... dairy/feedlot waste managers.
> One local dairy pumps their waste lagoon wateronto surrounding
> pasture...talk about smellin the farm be4 seein it!!!! phewww
>my guess is that they dont use this product.
> bill

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| Message 11|
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Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE
From:robert 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:49:45 -0400

unsubscribe

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| Message 12|
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Subject: Re: EM
From:CAVM
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:11:13 EST

Mark,

Does EM do anything for poultry litter odors which are mostly ammonia?Where 
would I learn more?

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| Message 13|
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Subject: Re: EM
From:William Evans 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:22:53 -0800

> Does EM do anything for poultry litter odors which are mostly ammonia?Where
> would I learn more?

http://209.153.214.27/

 Earth-Saving Revolution Vol. II now available!

 “Ushering in Perhaps the Greatest Earth Changes
 Since the Industrial revolution.” Dr.Teruo Higa,
 Founder-Developer of EM, in his book: “AN EARTH
SAVING
 REVOLUTION”

EM TECHNOLOGIES, INC. 

WHAT IS EM?

 ORIGINATION

 The existence of Effective Microorganisms was
discovered
 in the 1980’s by Dr. Teruo Higa, Professor of
Horticulture at
 University of the Ryukyus in Okinawa, Japan. EM
technology
 has been researched, developed, and applied for a
 multitude of uses and is now being utilized in more
than 80
 countries worldwide. EM Technologies, Inc. is a
not-for-profit
 organization incorporated in June of 1993 to help
make the
 benefits of EM technology available to the United
States and
 the Americas. All proceeds of sales of EM Products
are used
 to support our non-profit activities.

“Don’t doubt that a small group of thoughtful,
committed citizens can change
the world; indeed it’s the only thing that ever
has.” - Margaret Mead

 Contact Information

 Telephone 
520-629-9301 or 800-461-5296 
 FAX 
520-629-9039 
 Postal address 
1802 W. Grant, Suite 122 - Tucson, AZ -
85745-1232 
 Electronic mail 
General Information: naturefarm@earthlink.net
Sales: emtech@azstarnet.com
Customer Support: emtech@azstarnet.com

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| Message 14|
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Subject: Re: EM (swine)
From:William Evans 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:25:10 -0800

ammonia is ammonia...
> 
> > Does EM do anything for poultry litter odors which are mostly ammonia?Where
> > would I learn more?
> 
> http://209.153.214.27/
> http://209.153.214.27/documents/swineproduction.html
>

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| Message 15|
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Subject: graPEfruit seed extract kills algae
From:William Evans 
Date:Mon, 10 Jan 2000 22:04:05 -0800

http://www.nutriteam.com/water.htm#veg
Fish Tank Algaecide

At very low concentrations, grapefruit seed extract can be a
most 
effective algaecide for fish tanks, while offering very low toxicity to
fish. 
As is the relative case with human consumption, at low concentration the
ingestion of the extract is actually healthful to fish, while
protecting
them from infection. 

In one test conducted in South America on coho salmon roes
with eyes,
 Dr. Carlos Roman, Zoologist for the Chile Foundation reported, "...the
doses 
between 75 - 200 ppm(of grapefruit seed extract) do not effect the
viability 
of the salmon roes." 

Now an algae-free fish tank of any size can be maintained...
Without the fear of toxifying its contents.