Aquaponics Digest - Sun 02/06/00
Message 1: Re: alkalinity and biofilter
from "Sam Levy"
Message 2: Re: a find --- and a question
from "TGTX"
Message 3: Re: alkalinity and biofilter
from "TGTX"
Message 4: Re: S&S System
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 5: alkalinity
from laberge@cil.qc.ca (LABERGE MARC)
Message 6: Re: a find --- and a question
from Marc & Marcy
Message 7: Please Clarify
from "Patrick Pierce"
Message 8: Re: a find --- and a question
from "TGTX"
Message 9: Re: Please Clarify
from "TGTX"
Message 10: Change of address
from "cvmunger"
Message 11: Change of address:
from "cvmunger"
Message 12: Re: Please Clarify
from William Evans
Message 13: Re: Please Clarify
from "TGTX"
Message 14: Re: Please Clarify
from Marc & Marcy
Message 15: Organic vs. hydroponic
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 16: Re: Please Clarify
from "Dale Robinson"
Message 17: Re: Organic vs. hydroponic
from "TGTX"
Message 18: Has any one heard of NONI (Morinda Citrifolia)
from Robert WALKER
Message 19: About me
from "Melisa Wennerholm"
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| Message 1 |
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Subject: Re: alkalinity and biofilter
From: "Sam Levy"
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 01:13:51 PST
marc-
if the settled material is preventing contact between the water and the
biofilter medium you may have a temporary problem. in the future you may
want to use a "chamber" to dissolve the material in the water (this can be
as simple as a bucket allowing the system water to flow through & slowly
dissove the carbonate).
if you don't have plants in the system you can mediate nitrite effects to
some extent by adding chloride to the water--although you should check w/you
fish supplier to know how high a salt concentration the trout will take
(some strains can grow in full strength seawater).
sam
>
remove my fish due to nitrite skyrocketing
>to 16.9 PPM.
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| Message 2 |
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Subject: Re: a find --- and a question
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 04:22:41 -0600
Ted wrote:
> In my book, I am satisfied with an organic definition that just means you
> don't use synthetic pesticides.
Oh, and that the system or method strives for resource efficiency and
pollution/erosion prevention in that it conserves and stabilizes resources
such as soil, nutrients, and water. But that is just an idiosyncratic
aspect of my peculiar and hopefully not endless definition.
Ted
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| Message 3 |
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Subject: Re: alkalinity and biofilter
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 04:55:48 -0600
>. in the future you may
> want to use a "chamber" to dissolve the material in the water (this can be
> as simple as a bucket allowing the system water to flow through & slowly
> dissove the carbonate).
>
If it is calcium carbonate, that will be very slow indeed, since CaCO3 is
much more insoluble than sodium bicarbonate in water at the same pH. I
would suggest the presence of a small amount of CaCO3 is good for a
preventative buffer, rather than adding it as a reactive measure, due to its
slow or low solubility.
My pea gravel consists of about 10% acid soluble fraction, meaning that it
is 10% calcium and magnesium carbonate....basically limestone. That also
means that 90% is basically silica or silicate minerals of one form or
another...quartz, etc. This gives enough buffering capacity to "control"
pH. Although some might claim that such a system runs at a higher than
"optimum" pH....(optimum being claimed to be around 6.8 for an aquaponics
system with Tilapia...this is a compromise, so it is said, between what the
plants really like...maybe 5 to 5.8...and what the fish can tolerate)......I
have found that aquaponics systems that run well in all other aspects can
run well above pH 7 and grow plants just fine. I attribute that to the
nutrient transport and other biochemical ctivities of beneficial bacteria on
the biofilms associated with the growing media.
If your system is overloaded with feed and or fish and consequently a
massive biomass of heterotrophic bacteria and sludge has developed,
dissolved CO2 can go way up, and pH will start going way down, if your
growing media does not buffer your nutrient solution fast enough, that is,
if the buffer is not soluble enough, or if it is thoroughly coated with
organics (i.e, sludge) to the degree that it is less available...there would
be less physical contact between that solid buffer material surface and the
recirculating water, perhaps....or if physical aeration is low to the point
that CO2 is not blown off or "stripped", as they say.
The out of control nitrite you mentioned may be an artifact of what I call
the pile up effect of nitrification in recirculation aquaculture systems.
Image the nitrification process in a biofilter as a worker that must
transfer bricks from one pile to another pile one brick at a time, and the
"rule" is that the brick must be tossed to the top of the pile, not at the
base of the pile. Or, imagine a fence between the 2 piles of bricks, in
this case nitrite and nitrate, such that the fence gets higher the higher
the nitrate pile gets. So, it takes more energy to toss the brick from the
nitrite pile to the nitrate pile, so to speak, if nitrate accumulates, while
the bricks from ammonia to nitrite just keep on coming in, thus nitrite
accumulates....kind of like the accordion effect on a freeway as a few
motorists slow down to rubberneck and gawk at somebody with a flat tire.
This is a very simple and somewhat incorrect analogy, because what can also
happen is that if nitrate gets very high, some of it can start sliding back
to nitrite, so I guess I could embellish the analogy with a backward brick
landslide, or a leaky fence back to the nitrite pile. (Remember those 2 way
arrows in equilibrium reaction equations in chemistry class...and you
thought you'd never use that in the real world! :>))
Anyway, it seems you might need to bring the plant biomass way up and it
should be rapidly growing and assimilating rather than senencent vegetation.
Alternatively, a denitrification column or area can be designed to convert
NO3 to N2 under anoxic or near anoxic conditions. Also, if pH went that
haywire I would suggest a trickle tower or more vigorous physical aeration
or something to strip CO2 out of the system....ultimately you should ask
yourself what is the cause of the low pH....if you are overloaded with feed
or fish or solids accumulation that would drive dissolved CO2 up and pH way
down, in which case you may have to revisit your operation methods or design
features.
Hope this helps.
Ted
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| Message 4 |
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Subject: Re: S&S System
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 07:49:45 -0600
At 07:02 PM 02/02/2000 -0500, D.Bennett wrote:
>>plants and the fish lived without any additional areation. Everything I was
>>told and read about the S&S system really worked. Next I built from scrap
>>
>Well, I haven't been told, and read only what I could find on the
>internet page, so..... please, I'd like to know more about the
>S&S System.
>Your internet page sounds good, but I for one need to know
>more. :-)
I really appreciate the interest. For anyone who's interested, the 1998 The
Growing EDGE article about our operation is posted at
http://www.mbda.gov/Virtual_Centers/Aquaculture/ss.html
I'd be glad to send copies of other articles to anyone who's interested.
Please email me off-list at
Paula Speraneo
S&S Aqua Farm, http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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| Message 5 |
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Subject: alkalinity
From: laberge@cil.qc.ca (LABERGE MARC)
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 11:33:34 -0500
Thank You all, you people are great...I had time to post my question,go to
sleep then wake up to all your advice ...can't ask for more !
As I mentioned I am just getting everything going. I purposely kicked
started the biofilter. I am not worried about my nitrite peek; I have been
waiting for it. My plants are too tiny to have any affect on the system yet.
It was the first time I ever used CaCo3, was a little tired, and noticed how
insoluble it was once it was too late. The only concern I have is choking my
bacteria. I'll hope for the best.
Marc Laberge
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| Message 6 |
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Subject: Re: a find --- and a question
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 09:42:27 -0700
..snip..
> In my book, I
..snip..
Ted, you wrote a book? Where can I get a copy?
Marc
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| Message 7 |
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Subject: Please Clarify
From: "Patrick Pierce"
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 13:36:50 EST
Friends,
A local produce buyer has asked, "What is the differenc between organically
grown produce and hydroponically grown produce?"
Also would there be any advantages either way?
I would sppreciate your input
PP
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| Message 8 |
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Subject: Re: a find --- and a question
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 12:45:49 -0600
> Ted, you wrote a book?
Marc,
"Everyday I Write The Book" - Elvis Costello
Ted
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| Message 9 |
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Subject: Re: Please Clarify
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 13:36:21 -0600
> Friends,
> A local produce buyer has asked, "What is the differenc between
organically
> grown produce and hydroponically grown produce?"
>
> Also would there be any advantages either way?
>
Patrick, I wrote an article for the 1st anniversary issue of the Aquaponics
Journal that touches on your question. It is rather involved.
My aquaponics system was organically certified by TDA (Texas Department of
Agriculture) to grow salad greens and basil even though it was "soil-less"
plant culture...it was organic in that organic matter was used in the
nutrition of the plants, and the growing medium was natural mineral (pea
gravel), and because I never used any synthetic pesticides or fertilizers.
The plants really got their nutrients from the bacteria working on the
contents of the aquaculture water.... in which I grew the Tilapia.
Hydroponic culture of plants using "artificial" fertilizers (i.e, Calcium
nitrate plus other pure inorganic nutrient and mineral salts dissolved in
water) is pretty much outside the definition of most organic certifying
organizations that I am aware of....TDA is one example. The reasons are
pretty vague and nebulous, or at least they don't sound very scientifically
compelling...
In Chairman Ted's little red book and world view.....you could grow one heck
of a clean, nutritious crop without synthetic pesticides, using only
botanical or biological pest controls, conserving soil and water by
eliminating soil erosion and recirculating water, having the responsible
practices and proper places to sequester, stabilize, and save for beneficial
use elsewhere the "inorganic" hydroponic nutrient that you do end up
"dumping" periodically (as long as you dump it in an organic system that
conserves and stabilizes it), and so on, and it would not bother me to
consider that "organic"....but that's just idiosyncratic me.
With the possible exeption of Florida (I heard they have a draft set of
organic certification standards for hydroponic agriculture), I don't think
you could get that kind of hydroponic system certified as organic by many
certification organizations.
If you can get a copy of "Hydroponic Food Production by Howard M.Resh, PhD.,
there is what I regard to be a good discussion of the question of organic
versus inorganic gardening on pages 40 through about page 42...Actually it
was about organic dirt gardening versus hydroponic nutrient gardening. I
paraphrased Resh's comments in a post some time ago way back when. The gist
of his point is this: From a plant's perspective, a nitrate ion is a
nitrate ion, and a potassium ion is a potassium ion regardless of the origin
of those ions , that is, whether or not that they come from organics in the
soil or from a hydroponic salt solution.
Dr. Resh writes: " Large organic compounds making up soil humus are not
absorbed by the plant, but must first undergo decomposition in the basic
inorganic elements. They can be accumulated by their contact with the
plant cell membranes only in their ionic form. Thus organic gardening
cannot provide any compounds to the plant which could not exist in a
hydroponic system. The function of organic matter in soil is to supply
inorganic elements for the plant and at the same time maintain the structure
of the soil in optimum conditions so that these minerals will be available
to the plant. Thus, the indiscriminant application of large amounts of
fertilizers to soil without addition of organic matter results in a
breakdown of the soil structure and subsequently makes the abundant supply
of minerals unavailable to the plant. This is not the fault of the
fertilizer but the misuse of it in soil management"
I take some exception to what he has to say here, but not much. I think
humic and fulvic acids play a role in organic agriculture beyond that great
role that they play in soil structure, as if that weren't enough. I think
they act as extracellular polyelectrolytes and that they can sequester and
"shuttle" nutrients as needed between various components of the soil or
sediment ecosystem. Aquaponics certainly has organic matter and natural
flora and fauna stabilizing and "balancing" the distribution and recycling
of plant nutrients.....that is, if the aquaponics system is designed right
and is operated right.
The king of water quantity variables in aquaponics agriculture is OXYGEN,
just as air in the soil is the king of the variables in organic dirt
agriculture...and air in the soil is made available by adequate tilth
(structure), and adequate tilth is established by large amounts of organic
matter, the queen of all the factors. Check out what John Jeavons has to
say about his biodynamic gardening approach (Author of How to Grow More
Vegetables On Less Space Than You Ever Thought Possible, etc). He keeps
those raised beds of his fluffed up with AIR. With adequate amounts of
organic matter and with enough moisture, his square foot yields are
tremendous.. And so it is in a manner of speaking with aquaponic grow beds.
When you see lots of earthworms in your aquaponics grow beds and as long as
the plants seem to benefit from the presence of these annelids and their
associated micorflora in the system, then you know that there is an organic
common ground between aquaponics and organic "dirt" agriculture.
Somebody in Upstate New York has experimented with "Organoponic" systems, or
something like that. I think they use compost tea and various things like
that. Along those lines, I grew beautiful plants in my aquaponics system
with little or no fish present just by adding fish emulsion and seaweed
extract. Tom and Paula and Gordon Watkins have done similar things, I
think. Now that would certainly be an "organic" hydroponic system, you see.
It's fun to think about these things.
Have a great week end.
Ted
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| Message 10 |
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Subject: Change of address
From: "cvmunger"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:44:09 -0800
Address should read: greenhouses@hotmail.com
----- Original Message -----
From: S & S Aqua Farm
To:
Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 5:49 AM
Subject: Re: S&S System
> At 07:02 PM 02/02/2000 -0500, D.Bennett wrote:
> >>plants and the fish lived without any additional areation. Everything I
was
> >>told and read about the S&S system really worked. Next I built from
scrap
> >>
> >Well, I haven't been told, and read only what I could find on the
> >internet page, so..... please, I'd like to know more about the
> >S&S System.
> >Your internet page sounds good, but I for one need to know
> >more. :-)
>
> I really appreciate the interest. For anyone who's interested, the 1998
The
> Growing EDGE article about our operation is posted at
> http://www.mbda.gov/Virtual_Centers/Aquaculture/ss.html
>
> I'd be glad to send copies of other articles to anyone who's interested.
> Please email me off-list at
>
> Paula Speraneo
> S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
> Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
>
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Subject: Change of address:
From: "cvmunger"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:44:58 -0800
Address should read greenhouses@hotmail.com
----- Original Message -----
From: LABERGE MARC
To: aqua
Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2000 8:33 AM
Subject: alkalinity
> Thank You all, you people are great...I had time to post my question,go to
> sleep then wake up to all your advice ...can't ask for more !
> As I mentioned I am just getting everything going. I purposely kicked
> started the biofilter. I am not worried about my nitrite peek; I have been
> waiting for it. My plants are too tiny to have any affect on the system
yet.
> It was the first time I ever used CaCo3, was a little tired, and noticed
how
> insoluble it was once it was too late. The only concern I have is choking
my
> bacteria. I'll hope for the best.
>
> Marc Laberge
>
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| Message 12 |
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Subject: Re: Please Clarify
From: William Evans
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 11:55:11 -0800
TGTX w
> Dr. Resh writes: " Large organic compounds making up soil humus are not
> absorbed by the plant, but must first undergo decomposition in the basic
> inorganic elements. They can be accumulated by their contact with the
> plant cell membranes only in their ionic form.
Evidently the doctor has never seen photo micrographs taken w/ EM of
endocytosis
that occurs in plants ( too). Even smalll particles can be captured
when the celll
membrane " puckers"in and grabs whatevers outside the cell, and puts it
into
a little bubble pod to be transtprted to where its needed.
Such micrographic studies have been happenig now for at least 20
years...
references on reuqest
bill evans
who is not saying that ionoic " diffusion" does not happen- obviously
it does
just that more complex things can/are going on... and RESH has been
drinkin too
much mirackle grow
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| Message 13 |
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Subject: Re: Please Clarify
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 14:07:20 -0600
> just that more complex things can/are going on...
Yes indeed I agree ! Ain't it great?
>and RESH has been
> drinkin too
> much mirackle grow
I hear it can be pretty good with V8 juice, Worchestershire sause, celery
salt, salt, pepper,and some horseradish....it's called.....
"A bloody miracle!"
Ted
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| Message 14 |
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Subject: Re: Please Clarify
From: Marc & Marcy
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 13:05:16 -0700
Organic growers may have other factors to consider based on
the following news release:
Java jolts drinking water lead levels
SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA — Toss that activated carbon.
Reverse
osmosis? Return to sender. The latest in point-of-use
filtration is as
near as your neighborhood Starbucks.
An international team of scientists has found that
ordinary coffee
used in a drip coffeemaker removes 78 to 90 percent of
dissolved
lead, copper and other heavy metals from tap water,
according to
the Environment News Service.
The Australian, Chilean and US researchers speculated
that their
discovery could mean public health risk assessment
models need
to be revised in areas with high coffee consumption
rates.
Dr. Mike McLaughlin of the Australian government's
Commonwealth
Scientific Industrial Research Organisation explained
that uncharged
or negatively charged ions in the coffee bind to the
positively
charged heavy metals. Removal rates are influenced by
the depth of
the coffee bed and overall contact time.
The scientists believe it is likely the process also
removes other
metals such as mercury, cadmium and zinc. Tea may also
work,
McLaughlin said, but not as well as coffee.
Quoted from: Water Technology, 2-6-00,
http://www.waternet.com/
Marc
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Subject: Organic vs. hydroponic
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:27:40 -0500
>
> My aquaponics system was organically certified by TDA (Texas Department of
> Agriculture) to grow salad greens and basil even though it was "soil-less"
> plant culture...it was organic in that organic matter was used in the
> nutrition of the plants, and the growing medium was natural mineral
Ted,
Aren't there some organic certification agencies who consider growing
plants in water "unnatural" and therefore won't certify any aquaponic or
hydroponic operations?
Patrick,
Organic regulations usually center around two major components:
1. No synthetic fertilizers
-------------------------------
Most organic growers derive their fertilizers by building up the
fertility of the soil through composting, planting cover crops and
adding amendments like manure to the soil. Most aquaponic growers
derive their fertilizers from fish manure. Hydroponic growers typically
use "synthetic fertilizers" which are usually derived from mined sources
- I think the organic objection to these is that they deplete the soil
when used in field cultivation and that it takes a lot of energy to
produce them. However, if you look in any organic farming supply
catalog you will see that there are a lot of industrially produced
"organic" fertilizers out there. In straight hydroponic operations
synthetic fertilizers are the most efficient, controllable form of
feeding your plants exactly the nutrients that they need. From a health
standpoint there is nothing objectionable. In any type of farming which
uses manures, certified organic farmers or others, there are risks of
contamination if manures are not properly composted to kill harmful
bacteria like e-coli and salmonella. I've heard reports of two organic
farmers in my area who spray raw manure on their fields - it may be
allowed by the regulations but it is certainly not an advisable
practice. With hydroponic plants you completely avoid this risk.
2. No "chemical" pesticides
---------------------------
This is where most of the general public is more concerned. Organic
farmers may only use what are called "least toxic pesticides" from lists
approved by their certifying agencies. Aquaponic and other greenhouse
growers, certified or not may also, by choice (in hydroponics) and to
avoid harming the fish, also practice "least toxic pest control". I do
because I have no interest in handling or eating the stuff. In
addition, there are very few chemicals approved for greenhouse vegetable
crops.
So the person who wants to know the difference needs to ask the
hydroponic grower specific questions about fertilizers and pesticides.
Adriana
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| Message 16 |
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Subject: Re: Please Clarify
From: "Dale Robinson"
Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 19:59:42 -0800
Bill Evens Writes;
> endocytosis that occurs in plants ( too). Even smalll particles can be
captured
> when the celll
> membrane " puckers"in and grabs whatevers outside the cell, and puts it
> into
> a little bubble pod to be transtprted to where its needed.
I looked at this process some time back when Bill brougt it to my attention.
I never did figure out just exactly how these particles get transfered to
where they are needed. It seems to me that the plant breaks them down into
ionic compounds before they can be "transfered" and used by the plant.
That aside, We have found that If the public is give good products with the
hydroponic label on them then they tend to buy them again. They also tell
their friends about the wonderful product they have found. The organtic
label is only as good as the product and I've seen some pretty rough looking
organtic produce.
Just my two cents worth,
Dale Robinson
mwhydroponics@worldnet.att.net
Http://home.att.net/~mwhydroponics/
Low prices on small quantities
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| Message 17 |
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Subject: Re: Organic vs. hydroponic
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 19:58:11 -0600
> Ted,
> Aren't there some organic certification agencies who consider growing
> plants in water "unnatural" and therefore won't certify any aquaponic or
> hydroponic operations?
Hi Adriana. Well, yes as I mentioned before, the rationale for calling
something organic or not by certifying organizations can be based on
something that you or I might consider ponderous or infathomable. And I
don't want to sound as if I am coming down on some of these groups...God
help them.... I guess they are trying, but it sure seems they shoot from the
hip sometimes before they seek informed advice..
Adriana, you wrote:
> feeding your plants exactly the nutrients that they need. From a health
> standpoint there is nothing objectionable. In any type of farming which
> uses manures, certified organic farmers or others, there are risks of
> contamination if manures are not properly composted to kill harmful
> bacteria like e-coli and salmonella. I've heard reports of two organic
> farmers in my area who spray raw manure on their fields - it may be
> allowed by the regulations but it is certainly not an advisable
> practice. With hydroponic plants you completely avoid this risk.
Again, I would take exception to any statement that says a risk is
completely avoided by some method or other.... especially when it comes to
microbial or food pathogen risks. Hydroponic solutions are rich in
nutrients.... and bacteria like nutrients. If things go anoxic, or even if
they don't, you can still find vast numbers of opportunistic bacteria in the
world ready to invade your body, after they have built up their populations
in a nutrient rich environment.
Recall my suggestion on this email group, in the last..millenium......Take
some grass clippings and some leaves and a teaspoon of soil, water it all
down and throw it into a big plastic garbage bag and seal it for 3 weeks.
Then take a microbiological sample..plate it out on agar petri dishes and
key out all the microorganisms. Notice that you did not introduce any
animal manure. You should not be suprised that all manner of pathogens and
opportunistic pathogens can show up and party hard, because that is what is
"out there"...everywhere.
My advice is that nothing is completely risk free. Granted.... hydroponics
solutions, primarily because they are low in organic matter, will be low in
bad bugs...but I have grown tons of microalgae cultures in various sized
containers with nothing but autoclaved, sterilized, inorganic nutrient salts
to start out with....and I have witnessed some of the most nasty
bacteria,protozoa, and other microwildebeesties do the wild thing in these
vessels under certain conditions.
Have a good weekend.
Ted
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| Message 18 |
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Subject: Has any one heard of NONI (Morinda Citrifolia)
From: Robert WALKER
Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 12:16:23 +1000
Hello,
I have just heard about a fruiting plant which supposedly has
great "healing" potential - or preventive capabilities!?
The name is NONI or Morinda Citrifolia.
Has any one out there dealt with this plant and is there any
information? If it does half of what it says it can then it
sounds like a good potential crop.
Any information would be great.
Robert
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| Message 19 |
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Subject: About me
From: "Melisa Wennerholm"
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 21:23:11 -0800
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="Windows-1252"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI
About 7 Years ago I Started studying aquaculter at a collage in =
Northern California. I lived in LA and had to Fly back and forth ever 10 =
days or so. My background before this was Alarms I owned a burglar and =
fire alarm company, however I loved to grow food mostly the "normal =
Way" in the ground. Had fooled with Hydro. A little but at that time =
there was little being done organically in the area, so I stayed in the =
ground. Sooo when studying Aquaculture in school learning about the =
nitrate/nitrite trouble. Plant filtering seemed like a very good filter =
with a added benefit of food. One of my projects in school was a small =
scale green house set up that work OK . To make a long story endless we =
moved to northern to prosper in aquaculter lost our butts and now I am =
back in the alarm Biss. and fooling around with Aquaponics.
That's my Story I like this group so far lots of good in put=20
Thank You=20
Don
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HI
About 7 Years ago I Started =
studying=20
aquaculter at a collage in Northern California. I lived in LA and had to =
Fly=20
back and forth ever 10 days or so. My background before this was Alarms =
I owned=20
a burglar and fire alarm company, however I loved to grow =
food=20
mostly the "normal Way" in the ground. Had fooled with Hydro. A little =
but at=20
that time there was little being done organically in the area, so I =
stayed in=20
the ground. Sooo when studying Aquaculture in school learning about the=20
nitrate/nitrite trouble. Plant filtering seemed like a very good filter =
with a=20
added benefit of food. One of my projects in school was a small scale =
green=20
house set up that work OK . To make a long story endless we moved =
to=20
northern to prosper in aquaculter lost our butts and now I am back in =
the alarm=20
Biss. and fooling around with Aquaponics.
That's my Story I like this group so far lots of =
good in put=20
Thank You
Don
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