Aquaponics Digest - Wed 04/21/99
Message 1: Re: Malabar spinach
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 2: Re: Malabar spinach
from "TGTX"
Message 3: Re: Progress report
from "TGTX"
Message 4: Re: Malabar spinach
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 5: Re: Basil, was Nutrient:Plant ratios
from "vpage"
Message 6: Re: Malabar spinach
from "Wendy Nagurny"
Message 7: Black pepper cartel
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 8: Raspberries
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 9: Ginger and cardamom
from Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Message 10: Re: Malabar spinach
from "H. Allen Sylvester"
Message 11: White Amur
from "Couvia, Susan"
Message 12: Winter Fruit
from "Marc S. Nameth"
Message 13: Re: Raspberries
from "H. Allen Sylvester"
Message 14: Re: Ginger and cardamom
from "vpage"
Message 15: Re: Raspberries
from "vpage"
Message 16: Re: Malabar spinach
from KLOTTTRUE
Message 17: Re: Progress report
from KLOTTTRUE
Message 18: Re: Raspberries
from
Message 19: Re: White Amur
from Jim Sealy Jr
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| Message 1 |
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:00:05 -0500
At 09:24 PM 4/20/99 -0400, Adriana wrote:
>I seem to recall some of you having good success growing and selling
>Malabar Spinach which does well under hot, steamy, summer conditions.
>Could somebody verify this and also let me know where to get some seed?
I've recovered some old posts on this subject - there may be other sources,
as well. Paula
----------------------
Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 10:25:21 -0600
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Subject: Re: Fw: Japanese lettuce?
At 08:18 PM 1/2/98 -0500, you wrote:
>> From: Harrop
>> To: snsaquasys@townsqr.com.
>> Way back in the early days of this great list you mentioned that you
>raise
>> some type of Japanese lettuce. Could you please provide me with the
>generic
>> and botanical names of this plant (I did keep the original message....on
>> 3.5" floppy. Darned if I can remember which one, though ). Thanks in
>> advance. Rob Harrop. P.S. Happy New Year and may you be happy, healthy
>and
>> prosperous.
Rob - The plant we grow is Japanese Malabar Spinach. Went looking for our
original seed source (of course it's buried in my invoice files from some
year). We've been able to save seeds each year, so I've not repurchased. A
quick review of this year's seed catalogs did show one offering from
Pinetree Garden Seeds (207-926-3400) and reads:
"Malabar Spinach (110 days) Start this one indoors in the North. Transplant
to a place where it can climb. The large meaty leaves are remarkably
spinach-like in flavor. In fact Basella Rubra, this plant, is used very
effectively in the agricultural display at the Epcot Center."
We grow it up string trellises in our grow beds. The smaller leaves are
added into the salad mix we sell, and some left to grow larger for
restaurant sales to use under entrees, etc. (they are beautiful spade shaped
leaves, very thick when grown to 8" or larger). I also remember a wonderful
dinner sometime in my youth (way too many years ago) when a group of us ate
at a wonderful Japanese restaurant, and breaded and fried leaves were served
as an appetizer.
Hope this helps, although I'm pretty certain my original seeds came from
another supplier.
Paula
--------------------------------
Date: Sat, 03 Jan 1998 17:11:20 -0600
To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Subject: Malabar Spinach
Sorry to double post - found my Park Seed catalog (800-845-3366) and that's
where my Malabar spinach seeds came from. It's wonderful for spinach
throughout the summer (and in a greenhouse that's too warm for standard
spinaches). Red stemmed, "mild-flavored, thick, succulent, dark green
leaves like spinach, yet it thrives in the heat of summer!....heat-loving,
vigorous vines can be trained onto fence or trellis to a height of 6 feet or
more". I must tell you that it will climb at tall as you allow. We have a
14' peak in our greenhouse, and the plants are grown in beds about 3' from
floor level.
Paula Speraneo
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From: YankeePerm
Date: Sun, 4 Jan 1998 11:11:58 EST
aquaponics@townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Malabar Spinach
There are two species of malibar, B. rubra and B alba. I think Echo, a very
worthwhile organization, carries both. You can email them at ECHO@xc.org
For Mother Earth, Dan Hemenway, Yankee Permaculture Publications (since 1982),
Elfin Permaculture workshops, lectures, Permaculture Design Courses,
consulting and permaculture designs (since 1981), and now correspondence
courses via email. One is now underway. Next Live program: Paraguay,
8/10-22/98. Internships available. Copyright, 1997, Dan & Cynthia Hemenway,
P.O. Box 52, Sparr FL 32192 USA YankeePerm
We don't have time to rush.
A list by topic of all Yankee Permaculture titles may be found at
http://csf.colorado.edu/perma/ypc_catalog.html
-----------------------------------------------------------
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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| Message 2 |
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:17:35 -0500
Hi Adriana.
I asked the same question about a year ago (was it to this group?).
I am still interested in finding seeds or cuttings.
I understand there are 2 major varieties. Reddish and Greenish?
Please lettuce know if you find anything.
Speaking of Malabar, does anyone know anything about a strange race or
culture of people that control the black pepper trade? I read a very brief
and strange passage from a book called " The Food Producing Garden" by a
British chap....Listen to this:......" The peppers we can grow have nothing
to do with real pepper, which is grown on vines in Malabar and marketed
entirely by a strange lost race called the White Jews who have a monopoly
of the trade"........
I've never heard of such a thing before....what in the world is this guy
talking about? Is this just crack pot ranting or is there something to it?
Where the heck is Malabar, anyway? When I first came across this guys'
statement in his book, I looked in an encyclopedia under black pepper, etc,
but found no mention about the people or cultures that are part of that
history....black pepper trade apparently was very important in trade and
commerce in the last 1000 years or so. This has got me so curious, that
it is getting curioser and curioser by the minute. Any
historians/anthropologists or Malabarians out there that can set the record
straight?
If ANYBODY can settle this hot topic, PLEASE let me know....I feel
like...you know when you have just one word left on the crossword puzzle to
finish it, but you have NO CLUE....? It's kinda like that.
Happy San Jacinto Day!
Ted
> I seem to recall some of you having good success growing and selling
> Malabar Spinach which does well under hot, steamy, summer conditions.
> Could somebody verify this and also let me know where to get some seed?
>
> Adriana
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Subject: Re: Progress report
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 09:25:46 -0500
Ken, you wrote.
> Hi Adriana, I have a couple of different types of wild Azaleas growing on
my
> place,5 foot tall and ten foot wide,with flowers as big as a coffee
> cup,beautiful rich pink and a sherbert color,a lot of people around here
want
> me to grow some for them,also have request for tomatoes and
plants,Ferns,and
> some black roses,and Coleus arrangements,I'm also experimenting with
growing
> some Crimson sweet water melons in my aquaponic beds,and rasberries,and
> thought I would try grapes on my north wall.Just playing around and
having
> some fun while I try to learn how to get the most out of this system,do
you
> have any recommendations on good sellers?anybody? I'll try anything.
Thanks
> Ken
Now Ken, would that be "sherbert" or "sorbet"?
Just trying to keep the record straight here.
Raspberries are reported to be an incredibly profitable crop for
greenhouses especially in the winter months. Try them in vertical towers
such as the VertiGrow system offered by HydroGardens or in plain old
hanging baskets. Raspberry vinegrettes and glazes are all the rage with
the Haute Cuisine Crowd, so the market there would consist of chefs in 5
star white table cloth restaurants, and perhaps the production of exotic
value added products such as "Raspberry Tamarind Fig Mango Chutney, La
Provincial" and other preserves, etc. for meat glazes or raspberry
vinegrettes you prepare yourself right there on the farm and sell at arts
and crafts shows or farmers markets, preferrably at urban outskirts and
Edge City where the power elite go slumming into the rural wilderness while
they shop for antiques, Appalachian handcrafts, bits of barbed wire, and
Grandma Moses paintings.
Happy San Jacinto Day!
Ted
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:00:58 -0400
Ted,
Here is a little bit about Malabar pepper.
http://www.frontiercoop.com/spices/notes/spices.notes.no10.html So far no
mention of a "White Jew" monopoly. Still looking.
Wendy
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| Message 5 |
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Subject: Re: Basil, was Nutrient:Plant ratios
From: "vpage"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 08:54:17 -0600
I grew Genovese Basil with success in my hydropoics system as well. Another
source of the seed and of plug trays is Richter's seeds in Ontario.The
reason their special select seed is important is because it is Fusarium
Oxysporum free. They are recommending the fungus resistant strain of
Genovese called Nufar. If you have any soil based growing of basil this
fungus can ruin any hope fo growing healthy basil for along time. It spreads
easily and is all over the world now.
I had to stop growing the basil in the winter here in Canada because the
humidity from my fish tanks caused it to rain on the basil. That is when I
switched to red ginger, white ginger and cardamon. All three multiplied
rapidly . I left the coir potted plants sittting in the flowing water
without problems.
Another wonderfulthing to try in hydroponics for ahigh end market are water
lilies. Maybe you all live where they can be grown ouside but for me it is
heaven to see them growing in the winter.
Richter's-www.richters.com
Their catalogue is very educational
Victoria Page
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| Message 6 |
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 11:06:53 -0400
However the Indian pepper trade does seem to be controlled by someone.
http://www.indian-express.com/fe/daily/19990213/fma13012.html
Wendy
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| Message 7 |
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Subject: Black pepper cartel
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:56:06 -0400
Ted,
I'm not familiar with the Black Pepper Cartel that you referred to. I
have however heard something similar about mustard. I've heard that the
distribution of mustard is controlled by Canadians who have a tight
handle on the market. Somebody I know had determined that all mustard
used in Colombia was imported so he planted significant acreage. He was
unable to sell any of it and had to export it to Ecuador to get rid of
it. It reminds me of the advice I'v seen more than once - don't plant
it until you have it sold. It's easier said than done, however.
Who was San Jacinto and what was his claim to fame?
Adriana
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| Message 8 |
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Subject: Raspberries
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:05:50 -0400
> Raspberries are reported to be an incredibly profitable crop for
> greenhouses especially in the winter months. Try them in vertical towers
> such as the VertiGrow system offered by HydroGardens or in plain old
> hanging baskets.
Ted,
Have you actually grown any raspberries this way? I have a one year old
blackberry plant in my yard with 50 foot long canes. I expect it to
produce for the first time this year. I can't imagine how you would
handle a bunch of these viney plants in the greenhouse.
There is a researcher here in Florida who is conducting trials growing
plants imported from "up North" that's a Florida term) as an anual.
That way the plants get the chilling phase they require to set fruit.
I've requested more information and will keep you posted if anybody is
interested.
Adriana
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| Message 9 |
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Subject: Ginger and cardamom
From: Adriana Gutierrez & Dennis LaGatta
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 14:11:09 -0400
Hi Victoria,
Are your gingers ornamental? Likewise how do you grow cardamom? I'm
only familiar with the seed for baking. How does the plant grow and who
buys it?
I've ordered from Richters catalog and am amazed at their selection.
I've wondered about using plugs in hydroponics or aquaponics because I
assume that the plug trays are grown in soil? I may be mistaken, they
might use a soil-less mixture.
Adriana
> I had to stop growing the basil in the winter here in Canada because the
> humidity from my fish tanks caused it to rain on the basil. That is when I
> switched to red ginger, white ginger and cardamon. All three multiplied
> rapidly . I left the coir potted plants sittting in the flowing water
> without problems.
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| Message 10 |
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: "H. Allen Sylvester"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:43:07 -0500
Paula,
Do you notice an *earthy* taste to Malabar spinach, like Swiss chard?
I did and I do not care for either one because of that. Obviously other
people are not put-off by that taste. I much prefer Chinese water
spinach (kang-kong in the Philippines and pahk boong in Thailand), which
is also not mucilaginous.
Allen
H. Allen Sylvester, Baton Rouge, LA
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| Message 11 |
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Subject: White Amur
From: "Couvia, Susan"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 13:26:11 -0600
I'm looking for a small quantity (about 20?) of White Amur (grass carp)
fingerlings. Does anyone knows of a good source for them? I've seen a couple
web sites that offer adults for vegetation control in ponds, but I need
fingerlings.
Susan
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Subject: Winter Fruit
From: "Marc S. Nameth"
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 01:36:02 -0700
Does anyone have techniques/suggestions/direction for
strawberry varieties for winter greenhouse growing?
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| Message 13 |
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Subject: Re: Raspberries
From: "H. Allen Sylvester"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 20:48:27 -0500
Adriana,
One variety of red raspberries that might be worth trying is *Autumn
Bliss*. I planted some outside in late Feb. 1998 and they grew very
well. They even had a few fruits on the original canes. they they had
fruit on the new canes starting in early summer, some until late fall.
Some new canes did not survive the winter, but those that did are nearly
through producing fruit now. Some of the new canes this spring are
already in flower - we are in zone 8b and had a particularly dry and
mild winter. I got them from Northwoods Nursery, which was taken over
by One Green World ogw@teleport.com. Their website is
www.onegreenworld.com, but I think it is still under construction.
Northwoods shipped in February while OGW did not ship my order this
spring until April, which did not please me.
I think the critical point for growing red raspberries in the hot,
humid South is to give them sun until early afternoon and then shade in
the hot afternoon. They also tend to *burn out* over summer unless you
are careful to keep plant food available and not leached away. A
greenhouse in summer might be difficult, but it should be fine in the
winter.
Allen
Baton Rouge, LA
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Subject: Re: Ginger and cardamom
From: "vpage"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:33:37 -0600
Adriana,
the plugs are soil based to some extent but they seem mostly like peat and
perlite.
I washed off the roots and put them into my coir pots. They did very well.
The ginger can be used to eat-the roots. They grow alittle like an iris. You
split the roots, the corm, to pot up new plants.It is a pretty plant and
edible too.
The cardamon grows in a similar way. (11/2 feet tallor so)The leaves, when
rubbed give off a beautiful scent. I dried them for tea.In sunny places the
leaves take on red tinge.
I didn't get hem to flower before the top split onmy greenhouse and
everything froze. I will try again soon.
Where are you?
Victoria
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Subject: Re: Raspberries
From: "vpage"
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 19:36:24 -0600
I grew strawberries in 3"pipes suspended in my greenhouse with tilapia water
running through. I filled the pipes with pot scrubbers and !! Great fun Adds
a great deal to the capaciy of the freenhouse.
.
Victoria
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| Message 16 |
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Subject: Re: Malabar spinach
From: KLOTTTRUE
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 22:52:16 EDT
In a message dated 4/21/99 10:28:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
ground@thrifty.net writes:
<< Where the heck is Malabar, anyway? When >>
The Malabar coast is the southwest coast of India,I believe they have changed
the name to something like Malankar coast,Pepper is a native vine as are many
other spices,white Jews is an old Arabic Muslim nickname for European
Christians,and of course they blamed them for taking over the spice
trade,when in fact they used to make up myths and legends,about various
monsters and snake infested swamps,where they harvested the spices,in order
to frighten other people,so they could keep the treasures for themselves,.Hey
ted,if you're thinking about growing pepper,maybe you could call it Ground
Black Pepper,what do you think? Ken
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Subject: Re: Progress report
From: KLOTTTRUE
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 23:02:44 EDT
In a message dated 4/21/99 10:27:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
ground@thrifty.net writes:
<< Now Ken, would that be "sherbert" or "sorbet"?
Just trying to keep the record straight here.
>>
If you're old Italian,it's Sorbet,if you're Persian,it's Sherbert,if you're
Arabic,or Turkish,it's Sherbet,if yiu're from the south,it's Shuhburt,orange
that is! Option number two,when you're sick,the jello alternative,smooth,easy
on the system,Pre-Yogurt.
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Subject: Re: Raspberries
From:
Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 11:17:39 GMT+8
Adriana,
I would like to work (tissue culture) on blueberries do you have any
materials you could share me re: the plant? The scientific name is
Vaccinium angustifolium or V. corymbosum
I would appreciate it very much if you could help me
Thanks!
Minda
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| Message 19 |
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Subject: Re: White Amur
From: Jim Sealy Jr
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 23:48:22 -0500
Susan,
Where are you? Several farmers around here (N.MS) raise them.
Do you want sterile (triploid) or not?
Jim
"Couvia, Susan" wrote:
>
> I'm looking for a small quantity (about 20?) of White Amur (grass carp)
> fingerlings. Does anyone knows of a good source for them? I've seen a couple
> web sites that offer adults for vegetation control in ponds, but I need
> fingerlings.
>
> Susan
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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