Aquaponics Digest - Wed 06/06/01
Message 1: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED:-Tomatos, lettuce
.what next?
from Mark.Bell1 'at' defence.gov.au
Message 2: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: Pond Aerator Solutions
from Mark.Bell1 'at' defence.gov.au
Message 3: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from "Arlos"
Message 4: fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from pablo obiaga
Message 5: OT: New addition to list
from "Devon Williams"
Message 6: Re: OT: New addition to list
from Peggy & Emmett
Message 7: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 8: Re: New addition to list
from "gutierrez-lagatta"
Message 9: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 10: Re: fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 11: Re: fish sp for acuaponics PACU
from dreadlox 'at' cwjamaica.com
Message 12: Pacu notes from the archives-Part 1 (since I initiated a limit
that caught me this time!) was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 13: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for
acuaponics HELP
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 14: Re: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 15: Re: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
from "Arlos"
Message 16: Pacu (picture of)
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 17: "jumped the gun"
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 18: Picture (for real)
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 19: Photos
from "Jay Myers"
| Message 1
Subject: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED:-Tomatos, lettuce
.what next?
From: Mark.Bell1 'at' defence.gov.au
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 14:33:49 +0800
Adriana,
Brand Sunmaster model cool deluxe
I recommend you try this product for your particular problem
The reason is I assume your plants response is positive tropism i.e. searching
for blue light. an important point with light is not just how much energy is
radiated but how much energy is useable by the plant. As it turns out you need
more around 450 nm to stop stretching. You probably have good lights for
flowering at the moment (guess only) I will try make my efficiency claim a bit
clearer. 1000w lights in my experience are not as effective and cost efficient
as 600 w. 1kw lights require the lights to be on a light cart or tracker create
even balance of light. the bulbs last about half the life of a 600 or 400. the
overall maintenance of a 1000w system is more costly. Im talking about the
holistic cost of one system to another and comparing it to produce produced. I
could go on for ages on the subject of light so if you have any more questions
do not hesitate.
High regards
Mark
PS if you look at the output of a 1kw light they are more efficient at producing
lumens this is why i originaly used them and i agree on face value it should be
the most efficient.
| Message 2
Subject: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED:-Re: Pond Aerator Solutions
From: Mark.Bell1 'at' defence.gov.au
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:05:57 +0800
Thanks for the reply
You can get these little bubbles to be very efficient as oxegenators and in the
process create air pumps to move your water
| Message 3
Subject: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: "Arlos"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 09:29:15 -0700
Bruce,
Any idea of the market potential of Pacu in the US? Is anyone raising them
commercially in the US?
Arlos
-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Schreiber
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Tuesday, June 05, 2001 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
Pablo The Pacu is a very active fish and in the wild they hang out
under wild fruiting trees eating the fruit that falls into the water.
They grow large fast I've seen them out grow large Aquariums in one
season and tank grown ones over 30lbs. get donated to zoos all the
time here in the USA. They can eat an orange in one bite at that
size!
So when you get them remember to stock them with plenty of room to grow.
And not at the density lb. per gal. that you finally plan to harvest
them at so they can grow and not stunt!
I could tell you alot more about them if you want just let me know
Bruce
| Message 4
Subject: fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: pablo obiaga
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 16:02:50 -0300
Bruce:
I was rather warried why I did not know about Pac=FA as I once was a
country boy, and some delicatessen like =D1and=FA eggs (S.Am Ostrich) lizzar=
d
leggs an' tail, Trahira and Bagre, Armadillo etc., are reserved for country
people.
There are two possible factors. The eastern part of the country, were I was
raised, has no rivers or water courses in general, tributing to the River
Plate system. It's part of where the lagoon south brasilian coast geography
starts=20
Second, there must be a temperature limitation (Latitud) for PAc=FA in water
courses wich water mass is not big enough to hold temperature through, what
some of you may call our mild winter, especially if that water doesn't come
renewed from the tropical north as it occurs in the Uruguay River and the
Paran=E1. May this be so?
Just in case, if I get some to raise, I'll shelter them in the greenhouse
I'm planning to build and monitor temperature through the night as I intend
to use a tank . So far the cheapest thing I could find is a 3,3x3,3x3,3
feet, very thick white poliethylene second hand tank. (250gall)
Pablo
| Message 5
Subject: OT: New addition to list
From: "Devon Williams"
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 15:09:12 -0400
Hi everyone, I just wanted to send a note to the aquaponics family
announcing my latest off-list happenings.
My wife and I recently found out we are expecting our second child!!! He/she
is due the end of January 2002!
Just wanted to share.
Devon Williams
Beer Belly Brothers Brewing
Watkinsville, GA
ooooo
|
oo=|
|
.o |
|
.| |
|
.|=|
|___|
| Message 6
Subject: Re: OT: New addition to list
From: Peggy & Emmett
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 18:25:24 -0400
At 03:09 PM 6/6/2001 -0400, Devon Williams wrote:
>Hi everyone, I just wanted to send a note to the aquaponics family
>announcing my latest off-list happenings.
>
>My wife and I recently found out we are expecting our second child!!! He/she
>is due the end of January 2002!
>
Are you still coming to Palm Harbor in October or are you going to bring
down Grandmas pride sometime in February?
Emmett
| Message 7
Subject: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 19:19:00 -0500 (CDT)
Pablo All of the Pacu in the USA. are imported as young from down in
your neck of the woods and as far as I know they have not been spawned
in aquariums probably because of their great size. they are considered
tank busters.
Bruce
| Message 8
Subject: Re: New addition to list
From: "gutierrez-lagatta"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 19:48:32 -0500
Now WHO is going to have the beer belly? Congratulations!
Adriana
> My wife and I recently found out we are expecting our second
child!!! He/she
> is due the end of January 2002!
| Message 9
Subject: Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:05:52 -0500 (CDT)
Arlos I would think that the market potential is good being that this
fish is so good eating . I cant say if any one is raising them for the
meat markets because I just don't know.
The only draw back that I know of with this fish is that up till now
they have had to import the fingerlings from south america for the
tropical fish trade because they are not being spawned in the USA due
their large size at breeding age . These fish become gigantic quite
fast and over tax any hobbyist size system so only Zoos or public
Aquariums have the capacity to breed them .By the way they are in the
piranha family but not to worry because they are vegetarians
Bruce
| Message 10
Subject: Re: fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:20:50 -0500 (CDT)
Pablo Try digging a small pond in your back yard and line it with
plastic to keep in the water if you need to. But just so you know Pacu
will grow fastist in a larger body of water than in a small one .The
tank size that you mentioned is a good start though but only just a
start.
Bruce
| Message 11
Subject: Re: fish sp for acuaponics PACU
From: dreadlox 'at' cwjamaica.com
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 20:54:18 -0700
I did some research on Pacu
. actually have a spawning tank I designed
on my verandah right now for the same thing.The major drawback with PACU is that it is very bony. The meat has an
apparent "buttery" rich texture.This fact means one of a few things.but for some
it means growing them till they are fat enought to cut
good steaks out of them.
I have a few sources of Pacu in Columbia
. for those who are serious.
Pacu's can be spawned, but like carp it takes a bit of know how. Im stil
on the learning curve there
but Colombia is definetly a leader there.
Interestingly
since Bruce has spilt the beans :>, (and I thoughtI was
smart here, as ted said a few weeks back
.seems like someone's got a
look at my business plan
.lol
.lol :> ) I was going to use these
fellas to be the first stage, grinding, macerating and processing atage
for some biosolids
(vegetable matter from certain agro industries
)
and then run a aquaponic thingee afterwards
bingo
win win
.? Think
of what Bruce QUITE RIGHTLY said re fruits dropping in the water and
these cousins of the piranhas going after with the same voracity!!
Hmmmm
.get to work guys
get to work its lonely here
need some
fellow brainstormers
.to walk the road too.
Whatevers left over
. would go to the worms
like Chris Weaver and
Bredda Charlie in St Croix are doing trying
Naw seriously
if I can help making contacts Id be glad to
Gnite.
(yes, early for a change
)
Mike.
(Jamaica)
Bruce Schreiber wrote:
>
> Arlos I would think that the market potential is good being that this
> fish is so good eating . I cant say if any one is raising them for the
> meat markets because I just don't know.
> The only draw back that I know of with this fish is that up till now
> they have had to import the fingerlings from south america for the
> tropical fish trade because they are not being spawned in the USA due
> their large size at breeding age . These fish become gigantic quite
> fast and over tax any hobbyist size system so only Zoos or public
> Aquariums have the capacity to breed them .By the way they are in the
> piranha family but not to worry because they are vegetarians
> Bruce
| Message 12
Subject: Pacu notes from the archives-Part 1 (since I initiated a limit
that caught me this time!) was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 20:46:28 -0500
At 08:05 PM 06/06/2001 -0500, Bruce wrote:
>Arlos I would think that the market potential is good being that this
>fish is so good eating . I cant say if any one is raising them for the
>meat markets because I just don't know.
Don't have too much time, but I did find some earlier Pacu conversations in
the archives. If anyone currently on-list has something to add, please do.
Paula
----------------------
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 17:45:01 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
I recently harvested the first fish from my aquaponic system and thought
I'd give a quick report. I only had a couple ready to harvest so take
the sampling with a grain of salt.
I harvested a Rocky Mtn. White tilpia weighing 1 lb 13 oz which dressed
out, whole and headless, at 1 lb 1 oz. It was stocked on 10/11/97 at 8
oz. I also harvested a Red Pacu weighing 1 lb. 12 oz, which also dressed
out at 1 lb. 1 oz. It was stocked on 11/16/97 weighing 1 oz. This
results in a daily gain for the tilapia of approx. .093 oz/day vs .142
oz/day for the Pacu. I'm sure some of this difference can be explained
by the more rapid growth rate exhibited by juveniles, the pacu being
stocked at a smaller size than the tilapia, but the fact that they
reached the same finished weight is, I think, significant. Most of the
fish in my system are tilapia (hornorum x mossambica) that were stocked
in mid-October at around .5 oz, and they have yet to reach 1 lb., so the
Pacu appear to be much faster growing.
The pacu dressed out slightly better at 60% vs 58% for the tilapia,
probably due to their very small head.
Both were de-headed, scaled, marinaded in fresh lime and rosemary and
grilled whole over hickory and blueberry wood. Both were quite delicious
with a nice glass of blueberry wine. The tilapia was moist, flakey and
white with a mild, slighly sweet flavor and was easily removed from the
bone after cooking. The Pacu was more rich and buttery due to the higher
fat content, the flesh was not quite as firm and slightly yellow, and
was more flavorful but not "fishy". The biggest drawback to the Pacu is
the presence of small y-shaped bones along each side of the spine, which
filleting would not remove. Although not insurmountable, this could
prove to be an obstacle to marketing. Other than the bones, I preferred
the Pacu for its rich flavor but my wife preferred the tilapia for its
mild flakiness, but we all found them both to be a welcome addition to
our dinner table and one which we hope to be eating frequently and in
greater quantity. I hope to find a better source for Pacu fingerlings
than the local pet store and plan to continue raising them along with
tilapia. The two are compatible and compliment one another quite well.
Cheers,
Gordon
-------------------------------------------
From: "Ted Ground"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:05:19 -0500
Gordon,
You just enjoyed some of the fruits of your labor, or should I say the fish
of your labors- Thanks very much for sharing the joy. I found myself
licking my chops toward the end of reading of it, enjoying it myself just
by your description.
Around here, we have just been talking about appreciating the great,
fresh-picked salads grown from our aquaponics system. They are so good,
for so many reasons- the taste, the feeling of creativity and uniqueness,
the harvest, the preparation, the remembrance of the care and labor that
went into it all, combine to make one little salad a Thanksgiving feast. I
think eating this home grown food of ours shall never become mundane or
taken for granted. Awareness of how our food is grown, what efforts were
made to grow it, harvest it, cook it, and so on, is all part of the
appreciation of good food. Don't you think?
Uh, Gordon, did you polyculture tilapia and pacu in the same tank? Did you
use the same supplemental feed with both fish? Did you feed the pacu or
tilapia any raw vegetable matter or fruit from your greenhouse? I have
been thinking about pacu for some time, but you are way ahead of me. I am
happy for you, and excited and encouraged by your results. I will send you
some info on pacu fingerling sources soon, if I can just dig it out of this
pile of boxes of papers and files. Stand by and I will get the info to you
as soon as I can. Retrieving hard copy files around here is like digging
through a compost heap.
Oh, how do you make blueberry wine? Do you grow blueberries there at your
place?
Thanks Again,
Ted
---------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:49:42 -0400
From: Adriana Gutierrez
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Gordon Watkins wrote:
>
> I recently harvested the first fish from my aquaponic system and thought
> I'd give a quick report.
Gordon, do you have any data on the cost to produce this quantity of
edible fish? I would suspect that the Pacu consumed more food to
achieve he same ultimate weight as the other. Only if you keep them in
separate tanks and document feed consumption in each tank will you know
which is more economical to bring to market or to the table.
-------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:34:29 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
No, they're mixed with the tilapia at this point, but you make a good
point and I will separate the species in the future to check. I do know
that the tilapia are less shy and are very active and agressive feeders.
Gordon
-------------------------------------
| Message 13
Subject: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for
acuaponics HELP
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 20:47:43 -0500
Date: 29 Apr 1998 16:57:02 -0700
From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
Subject: Red Pacu Requirements
What are the water temperature, quality, etc, requirements for this fish?
--------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:38:03 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Pacu Requirements
They tolerate the same conditions as tilapia, which is to say, less than
ideal. I maintain them at temps of 62 to 85 degrees F. in a
recirculating system and they have been very healthy, maybe more so than
the tilapia.
gordon
------------------------------------------------
From: "Ted Ground"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:07:29 -0500
Here are sources for pacu with the continental US (I have other sources if
these do not prove to be reliable)
Acuagranja Inc.
14629 SW 104 Str. Box 431
Miami, FL 33186
USA
305-386-3686
abacolatin 'at' aol.com
Ekkwill Waterlife Resources
7502 Symmes Road
Gibsonton, FL 33534
USA
813-677-5475
ekkwill 'at' compuserve.com
Southwest Florida Tropicals
10110 Laredo Street
Naples, FL 34114-3137
USA
941-774-3000
Investigate these folks at your own risk. I have yet to buy pacu from any
of these folks. About all I can say is that are nationally (USA)
advertised. I have other sources in Venezuela, Brasil, and Columbia if
anybody else is interested.
------------------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:07:48 -0400
I inadvertently sent this to Ted instead of the list. Let's try this
again. For all the lists I am on, one would think I would get this right
by now .
Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
remember correctly, pacu are largely vegetarian and would be happiest if
they got the scraps from the growing beds too. Would bring the feeding
costs down a bit to boot. =20
Wendy
------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:41:45 -0400
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Wendy Nagurny wrote:
> Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
The *pet* tilapia I have had grew fast, but the *pet* pacus grew much
faster. In a larger tank than a hobbyists 55 gallon or 150 gallon tank,
I can't say if the observed growth rates would translate directly under
different conditions.
I think it is also incorrect to state that they are largely vegetarian.=20
In comparison to their close relatives, the piranhas, I would say that
they are largely vegetarian. The more precise description, I would say,
is that they are thoroughly omnivorous and a real opportunistic feeder.=20
I've seen them eat live mice as well as boiled spinnach. Small fish
seem to be a favorite. I would say that in terms of their eating habits
they are cleaner eaters than most cichlids like tilapia, but overall
feed conversion is something that I can't say I can offer an observation
on. Remember, I've only ever kept them as pets so I never really took
notice to some of these aspects of their care.
I have also noticed that they are less tolerant of rapid temperature
changes than tilapia, but probably more tolerant of low pH and low
hardness. I've seen pacus apparently thrive in water at 3.7 pH in a pet
shop I used to work at as a teenager. Of course, after correcting the
water conditions and getting the pH up to the 6.x range with healthy
oxygenation and filtering, the 10" fish went through another growth
spurt right away.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 08:32:51 -0400
From: "Sandy S. Brown"
Subject: Pacu
I thought I'd throw in my two cents worth on pacu, while I should be
running out the door to get to the lab. Of the twenty-two species that we
currently have in the Aquatic Medicine Lab, the pacu (species
mesopotamicus) are my favorites. I've found them to be very intelligent,
gentle, and healthy fish. We started out about 2 1/2 years ago, with 24
fish, about 2.5 inches long, in a 55-gallon tank. They were moved to a
550-gallon tank long ago, and all 24 are now 15-18 inches long. Our
attempt was never to get them to grow rapidly, just to see if they would
subsist in our system, so they have been fed minimally. They started out
with an undergravel filtration system, but they managed to move the gravel
around so much that the filtration became ineffective; I had to add four
aquarium box filters, which get their filter floss changed weekly, and I
vacuum their gravel and flush water through their undergravel filter at the
same time. They have incredibly strong jaws and a heck of a set of teeth,
and they like to chew, so it was a challenge for some time to keep airline
for the box filters whole; I purchased four dog chew toys (stretchable
latex) and demonstrated chewing on them before I put them in the tank, and
that has largely saved the airline.
They eat Zeigler 3/8" Floating Fish Nuggets, supplemented with frozen mixed
vegetables (green beans, lima beans, peas, carrots, corn) heated in tap
water until they're warm. They enjoy other vegetables, as well, but this
gives them variety, which they seem to appreciate, and is not too labor
intensive. Their coloration is better when they get vegetables. They will
do OK at lower temperatures, but are more alert and active at 80-82F.
Those strong jaws and teeth (designed for cracking nut hulls in the Amazon
basin) can be used on meat, but they have never attacked each other, even
when injured (unlike the tilapia!), and when a pacu managed to land in a
tank of small tilapia one day, there was no attempt whatsoever at
predation. I was bitten one day when a pacu leaped over the rest of the
group, because I was feeding the vegetables too slowly and he got
impatient; he was unable to let go of my finger because of the way that his
teeth are attached, and his teeth raked the length of my finger when I
shook him off (three violent snaps of my hand), but the whole group
gathered around him immediately afterwards, and it was three weeks before
any of the fish would eat anything if it meant heading directly toward me
while eating--they would submerge, turn to face away from me, then go after
the food. The wounds healed without scarring, unlike bites that I have
received from tilapia and striped bass. Occasionally, they will "lip" me
while I'm vacuuming, which is a bit unnerving, since their teeth are so
close to their teeth, but it seems to just be a sign of affection.
We have just acquired three pet pacu; they're extremely inquisitive and
they mimic much of what they see from their location in the living room.
>From the time we began talking about doing aquaponics, my older son has
wanted pacu, but I feared their biting through heater cables; the way that
we are heating the pond for the perch, it would be difficult for them to
get to the wiring. We are in the process of applying for a permit for
tilapia, and it is now tempting to find out what the permitting process for
pacu is in Virginia. Think I'll call Game and Inland Fisheries today! I'm
late--gotta go--if there's any other help I can provide, let me know.
Sandy Brown
-------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 21:00:20 -0400
Ah
er
.Erik?
are these pacu or piranhas?
Wendy
----------
> From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
> Subject: Red Bellied Pacu
> Date: Wednesday, June 17, 1998 2:03 PM
>=20
>=20
> Does anyone know where excellent sources of info on these fish are
located?
> Print or online are ok. I have purchased ten of these and would like
> more detailed info than I have been able to find on the net.
>=20
> They are entertaining to watch, especially when feeding, as they strike
> their food most aggressively.
>=20
> ERIK
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:22:57 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu Sources
Here's a pacu souce I have, although I've never purchased from
them.Please let me know if anyone orders from them before I do. They are
associated with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu aquaculture facility in
Puerto Rico:
=09
There is a US based company - Pantanal Tropical Fish - that represents
the
Projeto Pacu in the US. They are based in Miami and you can reach him at
+(305)274-0450 or +(305)274-0750, speak to Gabriel or his wife Lu. This
company deals mainly with the fish we produce for the ornamental market,
but he probably will be able to assist you with pacu or other
south-american freshwater fingerlings.
You are also welcome to contact us directly at:
Phone/fax:+55-67-721-1220
prj_pacu 'at' alanet.com.br
Jo=E3o L. Campos
Projeto Pacu
campos 'at' douranet.com.br
---------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:25:44 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Erik,
Here's some personal correespondence I got foem the manager of Projecto
Pacu that may be of interest. My minimal research led me to the Black
Pacu, over the Red because of the larger size.
Gordon
> Dear Mr Watkins,
>=20
> There really is little information published on the Colossomas, most of=
the
> information I can give you is based on on-farm experience rather then
> scientific data.=20
> Pacus do grow fast, if provided with ideal temperatures, feed and water
> quality.
> As far as temperature they seem to prefer it around 28 Celcius, and
> tolerate as low as 15 C (amazonic species) and around 10-12 C (Southern
> sp). I have seen Tambaqui (Colossoma macropomum) eating very actively on=
35
> C water.
> These fish are quite hardy, and tolerate low Diss. Oxigen and other water
> quality variables at least as much as tilapia.
> In Brazil farmers use 28 to 32% protein feeds for growout in open ponds,
> but there is some evidence that they might require less. they are also
> quite efficient in using plant protein.
> Farmers can, in South-Central Brazil where water temperatures drop to=
15-20
> C in the winter, grow their fish to 1,0 to 2,0 kg in a year depending on
> stocking densities, etc. In north Brazil with constant temperatures I have
> seen results as good as 3,5 kg/year in commercial operations at low
> densities in ponds (0,3 fish/m2).
> I dont know which species of pacu would best suit you (there are more than
> 20) but keep in mind that they can grow over 20 kg. Meet quality is good,
> but the fish have a tendency to get fat in culture conditions. They also
> have intramuscular "y"-shaped bones in the fillet.
> In time, they will do well in intensive systems.
>=20
> If you need any more information, feel free to write me at any time.
>=20
> best regards,
>=20
> Jo=E3o L. Campos
> Projeto Pacu
> campos 'at' douranet.com.br
------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 17:34:27 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Chris,
Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It=
has
more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is=
the
floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big=
Pacu
they're not too objectionable.
My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping=
and,
while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not disturbed
frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Gordon
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> I have personally been trying my hand at raising Pacu as food fish.
> Word of warning - they are extremely flighty even into their adulthood.
> The tank must be well covered.
>
------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 07:55:33 -0500
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Gordon Watkins wrote:
> Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
Just raising them. My tank is only 135 gallons (aquarium style). I
just wanna see if they are worth the trouble. I can't exactly go buy a
tilapia filet at the local fish market so I have to raise them up myself
to see if they are any good.
> I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
> grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It=
has
> more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is=
the
> floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big=
Pacu
> they're not too objectionable.
The fast growth and thick meaty body are the observations that got me.=20
I had a half dozen of them growing out and they were all doing great.=20
Then I had one extended power outage and lost all but two. :-( Since
then I have been kind of lazy about taking care of them and while they
are still growing, it is nowhere near as fast as before.
> My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping=
and,
> while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not=
disturbed
> frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Oh I think they've got many desirable characteristics and as long as
they can be contained, they have a lot of potential. Obviously you've
gotten a bit farther than me in that you've gotten them to the dinner
plate.
By the way, when I had those six pacu, part of the experiment was to see
how well they did in crowded conditions. I had a 20 gallon "high"
aquarium with a Whisper 5 power filter and a 6" air diffuser. 30% water
changes were done daily. I started them out on tiny Hikari koi pellets
and now they are on large Koi pellets. The growth rate even in this
tiny tank was phenomenal. They seemed bigger every day. Commmon sense
told me that I was begging for disaster but I wanted to see how far I
could take it. Each of the fishes got up to about 4 inches in no time.=20
Then the power went out, and stayed out. Nothing I could do would keep
the O2 level up and in a very short time one after another started
floating. When the power came back on, two were still well and one was
weak and succumbed within an hour of the power coming back on.
After that I got really lazy about their care. I stopped the daily
water changes. Didn't feed them on a regular schedule. Their tank
started looking really badly really quickly. I did some shuffling
around and moved my marine fish from a 135 to a 55 gallon tank (where
they are doing quite well) and the pacus to the 135. Unfortunately the
marine fish took all the filtration with them so the pacus only have a
single Whisper 5. I'd like to get some big fat powerheads running in
there again, and another Whisper 5 filter. Plus a couple of diffusers
scattered throughout the tank.
Now I can't go much farther than that without butting heads with the
state. North Carolina does *not* allow Pacu for aquaculture yet. There
is still an unwarranted phobia that these things could survive if they
ever made it to the wild (yeah until the fall maybe). There is also the
matter of whether or not there is a market for pacu in the U.S. If I do
start producing pacu commercially, where do I sell them?
So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
-------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 13:58:15 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu=20
Unfortunately, my remaining few Pacu ( 'at' 2.5+ lbs each) were lost in my
recent bout
with ich and I haven't yet restocked. They're really too expensive to=
purchase
through a pet supplier, even with the deep discounts I can usually finagle,
but I've
got a lead on a supplier in Miami connected with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu
aquaculture project in Puerto Rico. As I understand it, they sell several
different
Collosoma sub-species, including some which reach 20 lbs!. As soon as the
weather
moderates a little I plan to order a box of fingerlings. I'll keep you=
posted.
Gordon
ps: Thanks for the overview of cichlid filtration methods. I use home made
trickle
filters on several grow-out and display tanks and find that they perform
best and
allow the greatest stocking densities.
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
> still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
| Message 14
Subject: Re: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 21:50:13 -0500
Hi Paula,
These are some great notes. Part 1 & 2 concerning Pacu. I, for one for sure,
appreciate your effort.
Thanks
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "S & S Aqua Farm"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 8:47 PM
Subject: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for
acuaponics HELP
Date: 29 Apr 1998 16:57:02 -0700
From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
Subject: Red Pacu Requirements
What are the water temperature, quality, etc, requirements for this fish?
--------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:38:03 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Pacu Requirements
They tolerate the same conditions as tilapia, which is to say, less than
ideal. I maintain them at temps of 62 to 85 degrees F. in a
recirculating system and they have been very healthy, maybe more so than
the tilapia.
gordon
------------------------------------------------
From: "Ted Ground"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:07:29 -0500
Here are sources for pacu with the continental US (I have other sources if
these do not prove to be reliable)
Acuagranja Inc.
14629 SW 104 Str. Box 431
Miami, FL 33186
USA
305-386-3686
abacolatin 'at' aol.com
Ekkwill Waterlife Resources
7502 Symmes Road
Gibsonton, FL 33534
USA
813-677-5475
ekkwill 'at' compuserve.com
Southwest Florida Tropicals
10110 Laredo Street
Naples, FL 34114-3137
USA
941-774-3000
Investigate these folks at your own risk. I have yet to buy pacu from any
of these folks. About all I can say is that are nationally (USA)
advertised. I have other sources in Venezuela, Brasil, and Columbia if
anybody else is interested.
------------------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:07:48 -0400
I inadvertently sent this to Ted instead of the list. Let's try this
again. For all the lists I am on, one would think I would get this right
by now .
Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
remember correctly, pacu are largely vegetarian and would be happiest if
they got the scraps from the growing beds too. Would bring the feeding
costs down a bit to boot.
Wendy
------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:41:45 -0400
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Wendy Nagurny wrote:
> Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
The *pet* tilapia I have had grew fast, but the *pet* pacus grew much
faster. In a larger tank than a hobbyists 55 gallon or 150 gallon tank,
I can't say if the observed growth rates would translate directly under
different conditions.
I think it is also incorrect to state that they are largely vegetarian.
In comparison to their close relatives, the piranhas, I would say that
they are largely vegetarian. The more precise description, I would say,
is that they are thoroughly omnivorous and a real opportunistic feeder.
I've seen them eat live mice as well as boiled spinnach. Small fish
seem to be a favorite. I would say that in terms of their eating habits
they are cleaner eaters than most cichlids like tilapia, but overall
feed conversion is something that I can't say I can offer an observation
on. Remember, I've only ever kept them as pets so I never really took
notice to some of these aspects of their care.
I have also noticed that they are less tolerant of rapid temperature
changes than tilapia, but probably more tolerant of low pH and low
hardness. I've seen pacus apparently thrive in water at 3.7 pH in a pet
shop I used to work at as a teenager. Of course, after correcting the
water conditions and getting the pH up to the 6.x range with healthy
oxygenation and filtering, the 10" fish went through another growth
spurt right away.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 08:32:51 -0400
From: "Sandy S. Brown"
Subject: Pacu
I thought I'd throw in my two cents worth on pacu, while I should be
running out the door to get to the lab. Of the twenty-two species that we
currently have in the Aquatic Medicine Lab, the pacu (species
mesopotamicus) are my favorites. I've found them to be very intelligent,
gentle, and healthy fish. We started out about 2 1/2 years ago, with 24
fish, about 2.5 inches long, in a 55-gallon tank. They were moved to a
550-gallon tank long ago, and all 24 are now 15-18 inches long. Our
attempt was never to get them to grow rapidly, just to see if they would
subsist in our system, so they have been fed minimally. They started out
with an undergravel filtration system, but they managed to move the gravel
around so much that the filtration became ineffective; I had to add four
aquarium box filters, which get their filter floss changed weekly, and I
vacuum their gravel and flush water through their undergravel filter at the
same time. They have incredibly strong jaws and a heck of a set of teeth,
and they like to chew, so it was a challenge for some time to keep airline
for the box filters whole; I purchased four dog chew toys (stretchable
latex) and demonstrated chewing on them before I put them in the tank, and
that has largely saved the airline.
They eat Zeigler 3/8" Floating Fish Nuggets, supplemented with frozen mixed
vegetables (green beans, lima beans, peas, carrots, corn) heated in tap
water until they're warm. They enjoy other vegetables, as well, but this
gives them variety, which they seem to appreciate, and is not too labor
intensive. Their coloration is better when they get vegetables. They will
do OK at lower temperatures, but are more alert and active at 80-82F.
Those strong jaws and teeth (designed for cracking nut hulls in the Amazon
basin) can be used on meat, but they have never attacked each other, even
when injured (unlike the tilapia!), and when a pacu managed to land in a
tank of small tilapia one day, there was no attempt whatsoever at
predation. I was bitten one day when a pacu leaped over the rest of the
group, because I was feeding the vegetables too slowly and he got
impatient; he was unable to let go of my finger because of the way that his
teeth are attached, and his teeth raked the length of my finger when I
shook him off (three violent snaps of my hand), but the whole group
gathered around him immediately afterwards, and it was three weeks before
any of the fish would eat anything if it meant heading directly toward me
while eating--they would submerge, turn to face away from me, then go after
the food. The wounds healed without scarring, unlike bites that I have
received from tilapia and striped bass. Occasionally, they will "lip" me
while I'm vacuuming, which is a bit unnerving, since their teeth are so
close to their teeth, but it seems to just be a sign of affection.
We have just acquired three pet pacu; they're extremely inquisitive and
they mimic much of what they see from their location in the living room.
>From the time we began talking about doing aquaponics, my older son has
wanted pacu, but I feared their biting through heater cables; the way that
we are heating the pond for the perch, it would be difficult for them to
get to the wiring. We are in the process of applying for a permit for
tilapia, and it is now tempting to find out what the permitting process for
pacu is in Virginia. Think I'll call Game and Inland Fisheries today! I'm
late--gotta go--if there's any other help I can provide, let me know.
Sandy Brown
-------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 21:00:20 -0400
Ah
er
.Erik?
are these pacu or piranhas?
Wendy
----------
> From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
> Subject: Red Bellied Pacu
> Date: Wednesday, June 17, 1998 2:03 PM
>
>
> Does anyone know where excellent sources of info on these fish are
located?
> Print or online are ok. I have purchased ten of these and would like
> more detailed info than I have been able to find on the net.
>
> They are entertaining to watch, especially when feeding, as they strike
> their food most aggressively.
>
> ERIK
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:22:57 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu Sources
Here's a pacu souce I have, although I've never purchased from
them.Please let me know if anyone orders from them before I do. They are
associated with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu aquaculture facility in
Puerto Rico:
There is a US based company - Pantanal Tropical Fish - that represents
the
Projeto Pacu in the US. They are based in Miami and you can reach him at
+(305)274-0450 or +(305)274-0750, speak to Gabriel or his wife Lu. This
company deals mainly with the fish we produce for the ornamental market,
but he probably will be able to assist you with pacu or other
south-american freshwater fingerlings.
You are also welcome to contact us directly at:
Phone/fax:+55-67-721-1220
prj_pacu 'at' alanet.com.br
Joćo L. Campos
Projeto Pacu
campos 'at' douranet.com.br
---------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:25:44 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Erik,
Here's some personal correespondence I got foem the manager of Projecto
Pacu that may be of interest. My minimal research led me to the Black
Pacu, over the Red because of the larger size.
Gordon
> Dear Mr Watkins,
>
> There really is little information published on the Colossomas, most of
the
> information I can give you is based on on-farm experience rather then
> scientific data.
> Pacus do grow fast, if provided with ideal temperatures, feed and water
> quality.
> As far as temperature they seem to prefer it around 28 Celcius, and
> tolerate as low as 15 C (amazonic species) and around 10-12 C (Southern
> sp). I have seen Tambaqui (Colossoma macropomum) eating very actively on
35
> C water.
> These fish are quite hardy, and tolerate low Diss. Oxigen and other water
> quality variables at least as much as tilapia.
> In Brazil farmers use 28 to 32% protein feeds for growout in open ponds,
> but there is some evidence that they might require less. they are also
> quite efficient in using plant protein.
> Farmers can, in South-Central Brazil where water temperatures drop to
15-20
> C in the winter, grow their fish to 1,0 to 2,0 kg in a year depending on
> stocking densities, etc. In north Brazil with constant temperatures I have
> seen results as good as 3,5 kg/year in commercial operations at low
> densities in ponds (0,3 fish/m2).
> I dont know which species of pacu would best suit you (there are more than
> 20) but keep in mind that they can grow over 20 kg. Meet quality is good,
> but the fish have a tendency to get fat in culture conditions. They also
> have intramuscular "y"-shaped bones in the fillet.
> In time, they will do well in intensive systems.
>
> If you need any more information, feel free to write me at any time.
>
> best regards,
>
> Joćo L. Campos
> Projeto Pacu
> campos 'at' douranet.com.br
------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 17:34:27 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Chris,
Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It
has
more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is
the
floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big
Pacu
they're not too objectionable.
My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping
and,
while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not disturbed
frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Gordon
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> I have personally been trying my hand at raising Pacu as food fish.
> Word of warning - they are extremely flighty even into their adulthood.
> The tank must be well covered.
>
------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 07:55:33 -0500
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Gordon Watkins wrote:
> Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
Just raising them. My tank is only 135 gallons (aquarium style). I
just wanna see if they are worth the trouble. I can't exactly go buy a
tilapia filet at the local fish market so I have to raise them up myself
to see if they are any good.
> I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
> grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It
has
> more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is
the
> floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big
Pacu
> they're not too objectionable.
The fast growth and thick meaty body are the observations that got me.
I had a half dozen of them growing out and they were all doing great.
Then I had one extended power outage and lost all but two. :-( Since
then I have been kind of lazy about taking care of them and while they
are still growing, it is nowhere near as fast as before.
> My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping
and,
> while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not
disturbed
> frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Oh I think they've got many desirable characteristics and as long as
they can be contained, they have a lot of potential. Obviously you've
gotten a bit farther than me in that you've gotten them to the dinner
plate.
By the way, when I had those six pacu, part of the experiment was to see
how well they did in crowded conditions. I had a 20 gallon "high"
aquarium with a Whisper 5 power filter and a 6" air diffuser. 30% water
changes were done daily. I started them out on tiny Hikari koi pellets
and now they are on large Koi pellets. The growth rate even in this
tiny tank was phenomenal. They seemed bigger every day. Commmon sense
told me that I was begging for disaster but I wanted to see how far I
could take it. Each of the fishes got up to about 4 inches in no time.
Then the power went out, and stayed out. Nothing I could do would keep
the O2 level up and in a very short time one after another started
floating. When the power came back on, two were still well and one was
weak and succumbed within an hour of the power coming back on.
After that I got really lazy about their care. I stopped the daily
water changes. Didn't feed them on a regular schedule. Their tank
started looking really badly really quickly. I did some shuffling
around and moved my marine fish from a 135 to a 55 gallon tank (where
they are doing quite well) and the pacus to the 135. Unfortunately the
marine fish took all the filtration with them so the pacus only have a
single Whisper 5. I'd like to get some big fat powerheads running in
there again, and another Whisper 5 filter. Plus a couple of diffusers
scattered throughout the tank.
Now I can't go much farther than that without butting heads with the
state. North Carolina does *not* allow Pacu for aquaculture yet. There
is still an unwarranted phobia that these things could survive if they
ever made it to the wild (yeah until the fall maybe). There is also the
matter of whether or not there is a market for pacu in the U.S. If I do
start producing pacu commercially, where do I sell them?
So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
-------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 13:58:15 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu
Unfortunately, my remaining few Pacu ( 'at' 2.5+ lbs each) were lost in my
recent bout
with ich and I haven't yet restocked. They're really too expensive to
purchase
through a pet supplier, even with the deep discounts I can usually finagle,
but I've
got a lead on a supplier in Miami connected with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu
aquaculture project in Puerto Rico. As I understand it, they sell several
different
Collosoma sub-species, including some which reach 20 lbs!. As soon as the
weather
moderates a little I plan to order a box of fingerlings. I'll keep you
posted.
Gordon
ps: Thanks for the overview of cichlid filtration methods. I use home made
trickle
filters on several grow-out and display tanks and find that they perform
best and
allow the greatest stocking densities.
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
> still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
| Message 15
Subject: Re: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for acuaponics HELP
From: "Arlos"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:15:15 -0700
Dang, this group is a real wealth of information. thank you thank you thank
you!!!! Here in CA may be a perfect place to test market Pacu as Tilapia can
fetch nearly $8 lb retail and even far more I would imagine when they are
sold smoked and cryovaced
A couple of things caught my eye. One, if they
will thrive on a vegetable and fruit diet then I'm in hog heaven as I live
in nearly ground zero of the strawberry industry and witness tons of the
fruit trucked to land fill frequently. In a place where the strange and
unusual end up on a plate and not just walking the streets of San Francisco,
Pacu may be a real possibility here. CA Dept. of Fish and Game may have
other opinions though. That certainly is going to merit some homework on my
part.
On a more serious note as no one has yet to captivity breed Pacu at least
commercially. Is there any threat to their numbers in the wild. Any
knowledge as to their capture and method of transport? The chain of custody
for many marine species is brutal at best in unregulated countries.The
Marine Ornamentals industry as a whole is meeting for the second world
conference in Florida this November to address culturing and managed
fisheries practice as the only solution to reef habitat preservation and
species stabilization.
As always, thanks for the help from the wide range of experience here.
Arlos Anderson
Blue Lotus Aquatics.
From: S & S Aqua Farm
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 6:55 PM
Subject: Pacu notes from the archives Part 2, was Re: Fwd. fish sp for
acuaponics HELP
Date: 29 Apr 1998 16:57:02 -0700
From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
Subject: Red Pacu Requirements
What are the water temperature, quality, etc, requirements for this fish?
--------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:38:03 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Pacu Requirements
They tolerate the same conditions as tilapia, which is to say, less than
ideal. I maintain them at temps of 62 to 85 degrees F. in a
recirculating system and they have been very healthy, maybe more so than
the tilapia.
gordon
------------------------------------------------
From: "Ted Ground"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:07:29 -0500
Here are sources for pacu with the continental US (I have other sources if
these do not prove to be reliable)
Acuagranja Inc.
14629 SW 104 Str. Box 431
Miami, FL 33186
USA
305-386-3686
abacolatin 'at' aol.com
Ekkwill Waterlife Resources
7502 Symmes Road
Gibsonton, FL 33534
USA
813-677-5475
ekkwill 'at' compuserve.com
Southwest Florida Tropicals
10110 Laredo Street
Naples, FL 34114-3137
USA
941-774-3000
Investigate these folks at your own risk. I have yet to buy pacu from any
of these folks. About all I can say is that are nationally (USA)
advertised. I have other sources in Venezuela, Brasil, and Columbia if
anybody else is interested.
------------------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:07:48 -0400
I inadvertently sent this to Ted instead of the list. Let's try this
again. For all the lists I am on, one would think I would get this right
by now .
Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
remember correctly, pacu are largely vegetarian and would be happiest if
they got the scraps from the growing beds too. Would bring the feeding
costs down a bit to boot.
Wendy
------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:41:45 -0400
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Tilapia/Pacu Taste Test
Wendy Nagurny wrote:
> Pacu
.I never thought about eating pacu. They do grow fast. If I
The *pet* tilapia I have had grew fast, but the *pet* pacus grew much
faster. In a larger tank than a hobbyists 55 gallon or 150 gallon tank,
I can't say if the observed growth rates would translate directly under
different conditions.
I think it is also incorrect to state that they are largely vegetarian.
In comparison to their close relatives, the piranhas, I would say that
they are largely vegetarian. The more precise description, I would say,
is that they are thoroughly omnivorous and a real opportunistic feeder.
I've seen them eat live mice as well as boiled spinnach. Small fish
seem to be a favorite. I would say that in terms of their eating habits
they are cleaner eaters than most cichlids like tilapia, but overall
feed conversion is something that I can't say I can offer an observation
on. Remember, I've only ever kept them as pets so I never really took
notice to some of these aspects of their care.
I have also noticed that they are less tolerant of rapid temperature
changes than tilapia, but probably more tolerant of low pH and low
hardness. I've seen pacus apparently thrive in water at 3.7 pH in a pet
shop I used to work at as a teenager. Of course, after correcting the
water conditions and getting the pH up to the 6.x range with healthy
oxygenation and filtering, the 10" fish went through another growth
spurt right away.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 08:32:51 -0400
From: "Sandy S. Brown"
Subject: Pacu
I thought I'd throw in my two cents worth on pacu, while I should be
running out the door to get to the lab. Of the twenty-two species that we
currently have in the Aquatic Medicine Lab, the pacu (species
mesopotamicus) are my favorites. I've found them to be very intelligent,
gentle, and healthy fish. We started out about 2 1/2 years ago, with 24
fish, about 2.5 inches long, in a 55-gallon tank. They were moved to a
550-gallon tank long ago, and all 24 are now 15-18 inches long. Our
attempt was never to get them to grow rapidly, just to see if they would
subsist in our system, so they have been fed minimally. They started out
with an undergravel filtration system, but they managed to move the gravel
around so much that the filtration became ineffective; I had to add four
aquarium box filters, which get their filter floss changed weekly, and I
vacuum their gravel and flush water through their undergravel filter at the
same time. They have incredibly strong jaws and a heck of a set of teeth,
and they like to chew, so it was a challenge for some time to keep airline
for the box filters whole; I purchased four dog chew toys (stretchable
latex) and demonstrated chewing on them before I put them in the tank, and
that has largely saved the airline.
They eat Zeigler 3/8" Floating Fish Nuggets, supplemented with frozen mixed
vegetables (green beans, lima beans, peas, carrots, corn) heated in tap
water until they're warm. They enjoy other vegetables, as well, but this
gives them variety, which they seem to appreciate, and is not too labor
intensive. Their coloration is better when they get vegetables. They will
do OK at lower temperatures, but are more alert and active at 80-82F.
Those strong jaws and teeth (designed for cracking nut hulls in the Amazon
basin) can be used on meat, but they have never attacked each other, even
when injured (unlike the tilapia!), and when a pacu managed to land in a
tank of small tilapia one day, there was no attempt whatsoever at
predation. I was bitten one day when a pacu leaped over the rest of the
group, because I was feeding the vegetables too slowly and he got
impatient; he was unable to let go of my finger because of the way that his
teeth are attached, and his teeth raked the length of my finger when I
shook him off (three violent snaps of my hand), but the whole group
gathered around him immediately afterwards, and it was three weeks before
any of the fish would eat anything if it meant heading directly toward me
while eating--they would submerge, turn to face away from me, then go after
the food. The wounds healed without scarring, unlike bites that I have
received from tilapia and striped bass. Occasionally, they will "lip" me
while I'm vacuuming, which is a bit unnerving, since their teeth are so
close to their teeth, but it seems to just be a sign of affection.
We have just acquired three pet pacu; they're extremely inquisitive and
they mimic much of what they see from their location in the living room.
>From the time we began talking about doing aquaponics, my older son has
wanted pacu, but I feared their biting through heater cables; the way that
we are heating the pond for the perch, it would be difficult for them to
get to the wiring. We are in the process of applying for a permit for
tilapia, and it is now tempting to find out what the permitting process for
pacu is in Virginia. Think I'll call Game and Inland Fisheries today! I'm
late--gotta go--if there's any other help I can provide, let me know.
Sandy Brown
-------------------------------
From: "Wendy Nagurny"
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 21:00:20 -0400
Ah
er
.Erik?
are these pacu or piranhas?
Wendy
----------
> From: Erik.Westgaard 'at' pcsmail.pcshs.com
> Subject: Red Bellied Pacu
> Date: Wednesday, June 17, 1998 2:03 PM
>
>
> Does anyone know where excellent sources of info on these fish are
located?
> Print or online are ok. I have purchased ten of these and would like
> more detailed info than I have been able to find on the net.
>
> They are entertaining to watch, especially when feeding, as they strike
> their food most aggressively.
>
> ERIK
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:22:57 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu Sources
Here's a pacu souce I have, although I've never purchased from
them.Please let me know if anyone orders from them before I do. They are
associated with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu aquaculture facility in
Puerto Rico:
There is a US based company - Pantanal Tropical Fish - that represents
the
Projeto Pacu in the US. They are based in Miami and you can reach him at
+(305)274-0450 or +(305)274-0750, speak to Gabriel or his wife Lu. This
company deals mainly with the fish we produce for the ornamental market,
but he probably will be able to assist you with pacu or other
south-american freshwater fingerlings.
You are also welcome to contact us directly at:
Phone/fax:+55-67-721-1220
prj_pacu 'at' alanet.com.br
Joćo L. Campos
Projeto Pacu
campos 'at' douranet.com.br
---------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 1998 10:25:44 -0500
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Red Bellied Pacu
Erik,
Here's some personal correespondence I got foem the manager of Projecto
Pacu that may be of interest. My minimal research led me to the Black
Pacu, over the Red because of the larger size.
Gordon
> Dear Mr Watkins,
>
> There really is little information published on the Colossomas, most of
the
> information I can give you is based on on-farm experience rather then
> scientific data.
> Pacus do grow fast, if provided with ideal temperatures, feed and water
> quality.
> As far as temperature they seem to prefer it around 28 Celcius, and
> tolerate as low as 15 C (amazonic species) and around 10-12 C (Southern
> sp). I have seen Tambaqui (Colossoma macropomum) eating very actively on
35
> C water.
> These fish are quite hardy, and tolerate low Diss. Oxigen and other water
> quality variables at least as much as tilapia.
> In Brazil farmers use 28 to 32% protein feeds for growout in open ponds,
> but there is some evidence that they might require less. they are also
> quite efficient in using plant protein.
> Farmers can, in South-Central Brazil where water temperatures drop to
15-20
> C in the winter, grow their fish to 1,0 to 2,0 kg in a year depending on
> stocking densities, etc. In north Brazil with constant temperatures I have
> seen results as good as 3,5 kg/year in commercial operations at low
> densities in ponds (0,3 fish/m2).
> I dont know which species of pacu would best suit you (there are more than
> 20) but keep in mind that they can grow over 20 kg. Meet quality is good,
> but the fish have a tendency to get fat in culture conditions. They also
> have intramuscular "y"-shaped bones in the fillet.
> In time, they will do well in intensive systems.
>
> If you need any more information, feel free to write me at any time.
>
> best regards,
>
> Joćo L. Campos
> Projeto Pacu
> campos 'at' douranet.com.br
------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1999 17:34:27 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Chris,
Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It
has
more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is
the
floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big
Pacu
they're not too objectionable.
My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping
and,
while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not disturbed
frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Gordon
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> I have personally been trying my hand at raising Pacu as food fish.
> Word of warning - they are extremely flighty even into their adulthood.
> The tank must be well covered.
>
------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 07:55:33 -0500
From: Chris Hedemark
Subject: Re: Pacu (was Breeding tilapia)
Gordon Watkins wrote:
> Have you been trying to breed Pacu, or just raise them?
Just raising them. My tank is only 135 gallons (aquarium style). I
just wanna see if they are worth the trouble. I can't exactly go buy a
tilapia filet at the local fish market so I have to raise them up myself
to see if they are any good.
> I've raised a few in my system and I'm pretty excited about them. They
> grow really fast, get BIG, and I like their taste better than tilapia. It
has
> more flavor and is buttery without being greasy
The biggest drawback is
the
> floating bones which are impossible to remove when filleting but in a big
Pacu
> they're not too objectionable.
The fast growth and thick meaty body are the observations that got me.
I had a half dozen of them growing out and they were all doing great.
Then I had one extended power outage and lost all but two. :-( Since
then I have been kind of lazy about taking care of them and while they
are still growing, it is nowhere near as fast as before.
> My vats are beneath my walkways so I don't have problems with jumping
and,
> while I've noticed some flightiness, they calm down quickly if not
disturbed
> frequently. I think Pacu have great potential as a cultured food species.
Oh I think they've got many desirable characteristics and as long as
they can be contained, they have a lot of potential. Obviously you've
gotten a bit farther than me in that you've gotten them to the dinner
plate.
By the way, when I had those six pacu, part of the experiment was to see
how well they did in crowded conditions. I had a 20 gallon "high"
aquarium with a Whisper 5 power filter and a 6" air diffuser. 30% water
changes were done daily. I started them out on tiny Hikari koi pellets
and now they are on large Koi pellets. The growth rate even in this
tiny tank was phenomenal. They seemed bigger every day. Commmon sense
told me that I was begging for disaster but I wanted to see how far I
could take it. Each of the fishes got up to about 4 inches in no time.
Then the power went out, and stayed out. Nothing I could do would keep
the O2 level up and in a very short time one after another started
floating. When the power came back on, two were still well and one was
weak and succumbed within an hour of the power coming back on.
After that I got really lazy about their care. I stopped the daily
water changes. Didn't feed them on a regular schedule. Their tank
started looking really badly really quickly. I did some shuffling
around and moved my marine fish from a 135 to a 55 gallon tank (where
they are doing quite well) and the pacus to the 135. Unfortunately the
marine fish took all the filtration with them so the pacus only have a
single Whisper 5. I'd like to get some big fat powerheads running in
there again, and another Whisper 5 filter. Plus a couple of diffusers
scattered throughout the tank.
Now I can't go much farther than that without butting heads with the
state. North Carolina does *not* allow Pacu for aquaculture yet. There
is still an unwarranted phobia that these things could survive if they
ever made it to the wild (yeah until the fall maybe). There is also the
matter of whether or not there is a market for pacu in the U.S. If I do
start producing pacu commercially, where do I sell them?
So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
-------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 13:58:15 -0600
From: Gordon Watkins
Subject: Re: Pacu
Unfortunately, my remaining few Pacu ( 'at' 2.5+ lbs each) were lost in my
recent bout
with ich and I haven't yet restocked. They're really too expensive to
purchase
through a pet supplier, even with the deep discounts I can usually finagle,
but I've
got a lead on a supplier in Miami connected with Projecto Pacu, a large pacu
aquaculture project in Puerto Rico. As I understand it, they sell several
different
Collosoma sub-species, including some which reach 20 lbs!. As soon as the
weather
moderates a little I plan to order a box of fingerlings. I'll keep you
posted.
Gordon
ps: Thanks for the overview of cichlid filtration methods. I use home made
trickle
filters on several grow-out and display tanks and find that they perform
best and
allow the greatest stocking densities.
Chris Hedemark wrote:
> So are you working with pacu in commercial production numbers yet or
> still experimenting? I'd like to hear more about it.
| Message 16
Subject: Pacu (picture of)
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 22:39:16 -0500
HOLY MOLY!!
We have this conversation about Pacu. I had no idea what they looked like,
so I looked them up. HOLY MOLY!! Take a look at THIS!!
http://www.alanet.com.br/com/prj_pacu/pacui001.htm
I'm amazed. I'm a Georgia boy & I "ain't" never seen a catfish like that!
Pirannah
.no way
.that's a catfish!
Later
Steve
| Message 17
Subject: "jumped the gun"
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 22:48:19 -0500
Sorry 'bout that.
That is a picture of the "Red Tailed Catfish". But, it is quite interesting
anyway. Still looking for a picture of the Pacu.
Steve
| Message 18
Subject: Picture (for real)
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 22:54:42 -0500
Just thought I would share this. This is a little more like it. Even, kind
of looks like a piranha.
http://mc.net/tipper/pg000007.htm
Steve
| Message 19
Subject: Photos
From: "Jay Myers"
Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:19:44 -0500
Greetings -
Some folks have asked to see pic's of my greenhouse, so I have added a
section to my site. You can go there directly by:
http://www.aerialad.net/hydrofarm/
Enjoy at will.
Jay Myers
Panama City Beach, Fl.
|
