Aquaponics Digest - Wed 07/04/01
Message 1: Advice on Natural Pest Control
from "TGTX"
Message 2: Starting up in Aquaponics
from "Pete and Diana Scholtens"
Message 3: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 4: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 5: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
from "TGTX"
Message 6: Cool Space Portable Evap Cooler
from "TGTX"
Message 7: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
from Bill Patrick
Message 8: RE: Starting up in Aquaponics
from "Mark Allen Wells"
Message 9: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
from Peggy & Emmett
Message 10: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
from "TGTX"
Message 11: Re: Mud filters and sulphur filters
from fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce
Schreiber)
Message 12: Not Because They are Easy, But Because
They are Hard
from "TGTX"
Message 13: Re: Not Because They are Easy, But
Because They are Hard
from "Arlos"
| Message 1
Subject: Advice on Natural Pest Control
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 08:20:34 -0500
Check out the page on natural pest control
http://www.salescene.com/garart18.html
| Message 2
Subject: Starting up in Aquaponics
From: "Pete and Diana Scholtens"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 07:18:03 -0700
Hi all,
I just joined the list as well and I'm interesting in
setting up a small
system at the high school where I teach. I have a
number of questions that
perhaps some of you could have a go at answering.
What's the easiest hydroponic system for starting up
and what type of
substrate should I use for the plants? I know of drip
irrigation, floating
styrofoam, periodic flooding, and there may be others.
How do I choose?
What's the ratio of fish to plants in a mature system?
How do I start the system? I.e., how do I make sure
there are enough
nutrients for the plants, or enough biofiltration for
the fish without
harming either set of organisms?
My research on the web has indicated that there is
some disagreement about
whether the solids need to be removed from the water
before running it
through the hydroponic set up. What are your thoughts
on this?
What are the most likely micronutrients that will be
needed for the plants?
What's the best way to add them to the system?
How much light do foliage crops (lettuce and chards)
need? Will flourescent
lights give off enough light if I have a bank of them?
Thanks in advance for your help.
Pete Scholtens
Langley, BC
| Message 3
Subject: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 11:14:44 -0500
Hi Gang,
I've had a few people contact me concerning a good
source for Tilapia
fingerlings. These people want 1,000 or less. That may
be a problem.
I have never bought fingerlings, I have always bred my
own and ya'll know
the experience :( I had with that. I have only one
site to send these
people. It is from Americulture:
http://www.americulture.com/
I'm sure these people are wonderful, but do ya'll have
any supplemental info
that can be forwarded to people who may be interested
in buying fingerlings
in smaller quantities: 1000 more/less?
Thanks a lot
.Steve
| Message 4
Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 11:31:40 -0500
Hi Red,
You are in "more or less" my locale
.a little further
south.
I was concerned when you said that you had a concrete
slab covered with
plastic. "MAN, THAT'S COLD!!"
I covered my slab in the "farm" with styroboard. NOT
CHEAP! But, neither is
a system that doesn't work because it is too cold.
These guys are about
$15/sheet for a 4 X 8 sheet (for the good stuff). My
"farm" maintains apprx.
80F even when it is below 0 outside with the only
heatsource being 2
450-watt growlights.
I will be trying to do the same as you are this
winter. I have a hoop
greenhouse with no insulation. I have a pallet floor
down now. I will be
putting down styroboard and then covering this with
plywood
on top of the
pallets. (Again, NOT CHEAP!) For supplemental heat, I
will be running a
forced air duct from the "farm" (80F) to the
greenhouse (only a few feet)
away. This will be used for heat when my growlights
(2-1000 watt HPS) turn
off. My greenhouse is only 20 X 12 & I hope this will
be sufficient for
winter operation. I will be doing another couple of
smaller things too. I
WILL GROW TOMATOS IN THE WINTER!!!
Later my friend
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Medlock"
To:
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2001 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
Steve,
I actually was operational last fall, but
underestimated my heating system
thought I could do it with a wood furnace. I didn't
spend the money I
should have. Thinking about gas. The prices have me
worried. I am in
Missouri hour west of St. Louis.
Red
----- Original Message -----
From: STEVE SPRING
To:
Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2001 12:40 AM
Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
> Hi Red,
>
> Sorry, I haven't been down here for a few days. Been
busy (again!).
>
> Very nice size greenhouse. I'm envious. Maybe next
year.
>
> Ref: "plastic covering a concrete floor
heat is
going to be my next
> problem"
Heat
presense of or lack of? Where
are you located?
>
> Later
.Steve
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steven Medlock"
> To:
> Sent: Friday, June 29, 2001 12:36 PM
> Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
>
>
> I am using the S&S System in a 30x48' green house.
Just plastic covered
> concrete floor. Heat is going to be my next
problem I don't have the
> extreme thichness of the S&S greenhouse walls.
> Red
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: STEVE SPRING
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2001 11:54 PM
> Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
>
>
> > Hey Red,
> >
> > What kind of Greenhouse do you have?
> >
> > SS
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Steven Medlock"
> > To:
> > Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2001 7:44 PM
> > Subject: Re: tomato vibrator/scales
> >
> >
> > Just for info, I have ordered the bumble bees. I
will let everyone know
> how
> > it goes. There was no way I could pollinate 200
plants by hand. I am
> open
> > to any other options. the bees are expensive. But
to the amount of
blooms
> I
> > am loosing worth it. I have started with 30
plants way ahead of the
other
> > 200 or so glad I did that, now I can work through
all my problems.
Lesson
> > learned.
> > Red
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: STEVE SPRING
> > To:
> > Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2001 12:24 AM
> > Subject: tomato vibrator/scales
> >
> >
> > > I have been using and suggesting the use of a
tomato vibrator from
> > > www.hydro-gardens.com.
> > >
> > > See picture below:
> > >
> > >
http://www.hydro-gardens.com/growsup1.htm#pollinator
> > >
> > > It is a very good vibrator and cost only $14.95.
> > >
> > > I. Red, Alan and other subscribers have more
than a "few" tomato
plants.
> > We
> > > would like to know if anyone has any info on a
more commercial tomato
> > > pollinator.
> > >
> > > Also, I would like info on a scale that weighs
in oz's. Anyone out
there
> > got
> > > got any info on this. Everyone I look at cost
$400+.
> > >
> > > Would appreciate any input.
> > >
> > > Thanks
Steve
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
| Message 5
Subject: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 11:49:54 -0500
Bill Patrick, our amigo in Florida, can hop on in
right about now and give
some info.
On small quantity suppliers. Most want you to buy at
least a 1000 or 3000,
etc.
I used Aquasafra. I can pretty much recommend their
T. nilotica. Beauty
little fish. Tender flesh but "Built Ford Tough" in
the greenhouse, if you
know what I mean.
> I'm sure these people are wonderful, but do ya'll
have any supplemental
info
> that can be forwarded to people who may be
interested in buying
fingerlings
> in smaller quantities: 1000 more/less?
>
> Thanks a lot
.Steve
| Message 6
Subject: Cool Space Portable Evap Cooler
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 12:06:48 -0500
Completely Portable, on 4 casters. 8" thick pads for
greater temperature
drops, up to 28 degrees cooler. High air
volume
.up to 10,000 CFM yet
quiet.
http://www.cool-space.com 1-800-557-5715
| Message 7
Subject: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
From: Bill Patrick
Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 13:52:43 -0400
TGTX wrote:
>
> Bill Patrick, our amigo in Florida, can hop on in
right about now and give
> some info.
> On small quantity suppliers. Most want you to buy
at least a 1000 or 3000,
> etc.
That's right Ted. Mike at Aquasafra would only sell
me about 3000
fish. As I remember they were 10 cents a piece for
$300.00. Mike gave
the number of a guy on the west coast of Florida
(which I can't find
now) that would sell me 300 fish for around 20 cents
each. I also found
a guy in Palmbay Florida that would deliver some
tilapia to me for 30
cents a piece. All I was doing at the time was a
little research to see
if I could buy some fish for my 950 gal. tank. I
found that I could get
them fairly easily here, so I happy with what I found
and figured that
when I got serious and I could buy a small amount. I
think Ken's Fish
in Georgia sells small quantities also. Here's my
list of fish
suppliers I kept.
http://www.cherrysnapper.com/
http://www.fishfarming.com/
http://www.miami-aquaculture.com/
http://www.tilapiaseed.com/
http://www.Kens-FishFarm.com/
http://www.americulture.com/
By the way Ted did you see my direct email to you
about my San Antonio
trip?
Bill Patrick
>
> I used Aquasafra. I can pretty much recommend their
T. nilotica. Beauty
> little fish. Tender flesh but "Built Ford Tough" in
the greenhouse, if you
> know what I mean.
| Message 8
Subject: RE: Starting up in Aquaponics
From: "Mark Allen Wells"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 13:08:18 -0500
Hi Pete,
Welcome to the aquaponics discussion list. We need
educators
involved in this. I am new at aquaponics too and the
people
here are very helpful. I will try to answer what I
can.
I am not sure of your needs and how large of a system
you want
to build so we can start smallest/simplest. I have a
20 gal.
aquarium that uses a floating raft of 2" polystyrene
with 6
3" net pots over a well aerated hydro-solution. I
haven't tried
converting the hydro solution to fish yet but may try
fathead minnows. This link is a slightly different
design.deep water culture rather than floating raft
.but it
shows
the versatility of extruded polystyrene. Also check
out
his tomato cloner page.
http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/District/9046/hydro/lettuce.htm
http://www.geocities.com/WallStreet/District/9046/hydro/cloner.htm
My first aquaponics setup is a converted flood and
drain bed. I had
a 55 gal aquarium as the nutrient reservoir so I'm
converting it.
The growbed is 9" of pea gravel but would have liked
12". The bed was
made from a heavy old waterbed frame and 5/8" plywood
lined with
pond liner. I moved it from the patio to the basement
so I put
2 -4 foot shop lights over the 2'x4' bed. Yes, you
can use artificial
lighting. I still need to learn more about the light
requirements
of different plants, but the lettuces seem to do ok on
the 20 watts
per square foot they are getting. I haven't tried
horticulture bulbs.
Mine are a mix of cool white and warm white bulbs
suspended one foot
over the bed. There is a company with nice compact
fluorescent kits
that I may try later. Fruiting and taller plants
would require more light.
This system is more complicated because you get into
pumps, drains,
media and irrigation grids. I am still sizing my grid
and drip rate.
this link is a pdf file some good basic lighting info.
http://www.agnr.umd.edu/users/bioreng/pdf/72.pdf
This is a good article about a larger school
system
.you may have it
but just in case.
http://www.aquaponics.com/e_articl.htm
I believe the recommended fish stocking density is
about 1/2lb of fish
(harvest weight) per gal. of water. I'm starting with
about half of
this until I feel comfortable with the system and
bacteria colonies
have developed in the gravel and bio-wheels. It helps
to inoculate
the bed with bacteria starter cultures. If I'm not
mistaken, S&S
has them and there are others.
Now I need some help too
.I'm not yet sure of the
plant density.
Hopefully someone can help us here. I am sure there
is a EC/TDS
range that is optimum which will help me figure out
plant numbers
for my system. This would answer your question about
knowing if
there are enough nutrients
EC measurements (and the
obvious
health of your plants).
As for the fish, if you don't have enough
biofiltration your
ammonia levels will be high. Keeping dissolved oxygen
levels
up through good aeration helps. So can removing excess
solids.
This is from the following document."It is commonly believed that a filter has to be mucky
to encourage
the growth of nitrifying bacteria - wrong. If anything
this can have
the opposite effect with faster-growing heterotrophic
bacteria
competing for resources such as oxygen. There is also
the possibility
that many of the decomposition products from the
breakdown of rotting
organic matter may inhibit nitrifying bacteria, either
by direct
toxicity or creating a hostile microenvironment."
http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/filtration/nitrification.htm
I'm pretty sure they don't remove solids at S&S but
their systems
are very well dialed in and the beds are deep. I am
not sure many
systems are dialed in well enough to break the solids
down before they
build up and cause problems
.especially in smaller
systems.
Nutrient makeup
. I had read something about S&S
using a mineral
supplement. I am not sure if they still are. It was
called Planters II.
Here is their website. http://www.planters2.com/ It
was added in small
amounts to the grow beds. Calcium, magnesium,
potassium and iron
should be tested and added if needed.
I know this doesn't come close to answering everything
but I hope it
helps. I have to run. For smaller educational
systems, converted
aquariums are easy, cheap(used)and lend themselves
nicely to observation,
adding heaters, etc.
regards,
Mark
| Message 9
Subject: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
From: Peggy & Emmett
Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 16:38:18 -0400
At 11:14 AM 7/4/2001 -0500, STEVE SPRING wrote:
>Hi Gang,
>
>>
>I'm sure these people are wonderful, but do ya'll
have any supplemental info
>that can be forwarded to people who may be interested
in buying fingerlings
>in smaller quantities: 1000 more/less?
>
>Thanks a lot
.Steve
>
>
>
I got mine from Steve Abernathy:
tiltech 'at' bellsouth.net.
I ordered 1000. All males. Sexed by hybridization.
.Emmett
| Message 10
Subject: Re: Tilapia fingerling suppliers
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 16:09:49 -0500
Tiltech is a good source by many accounts.
I have talked to Steve Abernathy before.
> I got mine from Steve Abernathy:
tiltech 'at' bellsouth.net.
> I ordered 1000. All males. Sexed by hybridization.
.Emmett
| Message 11
Subject: Re: Mud filters and sulphur filters
From: fishmanbruce 'at' webtv.net (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 17:07:34 -0500 (CDT)
Is there any one out there that has used either a
mud refuguim or
sulphur denitrifying filter for fresh water
denitrification? How about
using a plenum filter in fresh water? In salt water
you get ZERO
recordings using any of them .
Bruce
| Message 12
Subject: Not Because They are Easy, But Because They
are Hard
From: "TGTX"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 22:12:50 -0500
"I propose, that by the end of the decade,
That we land a man on the moon
and do the other
things
Not because they are easy, but because they are
hard
."
Happy Fourth of July
2001.
Ted
Still Resolved to "Do the Other Things" as Best We
Can.
| Message 13
Subject: Re: Not Because They are Easy, But Because
They are Hard
From: "Arlos"
Date: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 21:03:20 -0700
And to think, we went to the moon on a slide rule
Arlos
-----Original Message-----
From: TGTX
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Wednesday, July 04, 2001 8:15 PM
Subject: Not Because They are Easy, But Because They
are Hard
>"I propose, that by the end of the decade,
>That we land a man on the moon
and do the other
things
>Not because they are easy, but because they are
hard
."
>
>Happy Fourth of July
2001.>
>Ted
>
>Still Resolved to "Do the Other Things" as Best We
Can.>
>
|
