Aquaponics Digest - Sun 08/19/01
Message 1: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Message 23: Re: Politics
from marc
Message 2: RE: Politics
from "Mark Allen Wells"
Message 3: Re: Gar
from Jim
Message 4: Re: Gar
from Jim
Message 5: Re: vortex filters / hydrocyclones
from Ian Franzmann
Message 6: RE: air and bacteria (small systems)
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 7: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
from "TGTX"
Message 8: Re: Water Water everywhere. from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 9: Re: water chemistry. from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 10: Re: Water Water everywhere. from "Arlos"
Message 11: Re: Politics
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 12: Re: Politics
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 13: Re: Bruce and ebola
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 14: Re: Ever tasted bowfin?
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 15: Real military aid
from DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
Message 16: Re: Real military aid
from "Arlos"
Message 17: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 18: Re: Real military aid
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 19: Military
from "Steven Medlock"
Message 20: failing on tomatos
from "Steven Medlock"
Message 21: Off-Topic posts re: Politics, Military or whatever other
divisive topic you want to call it
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 22: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
from "Arlos"
Message 23: Fwd. Aquaponics question (Non-profit)
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 24: Assorted resources
from S & S Aqua Farm
Message 25: Re: failing on tomatos
from pantryman 'at' empireone.net
Message 26: Re: failing on tomatos - follow up
from pantryman 'at' empireone.net
Message 27: Re: failing on tomatos - follow up
from "gutierrez-lagatta"
. .
| Message 1
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Message 23: Re: Politics
From: marc
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 00:35:30 -0600
I certainly agree. It seems silly to throw good money after
bad.
In one instance we had several drill rigs a government
purchased for its people our people were trainers on. At the
end of the first drilling day the drilling
supervisor/trainer indicated the drill string needed to be
pulled up or it would be stuck at the start of tommorrows
work.
The trainees smilingly waved off the pull with an ignorant
"Don't worry - be happy" attitude and indicated everything
would be OK so don't be such a worry wart and left for home.
Well fer sure the drill strings were seriously stuck the
next morning and non recoverable.
Their own government indicated all the training and self
help programs ended up failing due to the same "live for the
moment" attitude. The egocentric attitude of these people
was that the drill rigs were defective as they should not
get stuck. It never occurred to them that their discipline -
OR LACK OF IT - had anything to do with it.
Marc Nameth
Message 23: Re: Politics
> Subject: Re: Politics
> From: "Brent Bingham"
> Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 16:50:51 -0700
> I have a group of volunteers that have water well drilling rigs and farm
> irrigation setups and complete small farm building plans but they get shot
> when they try to go in and help. They have greenhouse / living units. Solar
> drinking water pumps and all sorts of things to relive the suffering but
> they can not get it to the people most in need.
. .
| Message 2
Subject: RE: Politics
From: "Mark Allen Wells"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 01:58:30 -0500
Hi Brent,
I think I agree with both you and Steve on this one
because
I can see both viewpoints. (Like Steve, this is my only post
on this
.not trying to start a thread
.just expressing my view).
You sure have had an interesting life. It doesn't seem like there
is much you haven't seen or been involved in.
>We cannot send an army with guns to guard every nomadic group wandering
looking for food can we ?
Brent
I agree with what you said to an extent.
but oil definitely was a factor in Kuwait. An old article clip.
"The real reason for U.S. opposition to Iraqi occupation of Kuwait is not
to keep oil prices low, but to keep Washington, Wall Street, and their
allies in charge of setting oil prices. We are fighting to maintain and
even enlarge one of our few continuing claims to international economic
clout: control of oil prices. The Bush administration and the New York
Times alike view the Mideast as an extension of Texas. It is "our oil,"
not theirs. The U.S. oil posture is not a sober defense of countries
dependent on oil. It is a greedy offensive that pursues U.S. oil advantage.
Most countries, particularly Third World countries, suffer horribly for
these policies".
--
We can't guard everyone but we shouldn't be doing things like this either.another older article.
--
"Another point that many people don’t seem to know about, or if they do then
choose not to discuss, is the fact that Cheney as Defense Secretary secretly
received Nigeria’s General Sani Abacha in the U.S. prior to the election
that was won by Mashood Abiola and thwarted by Gen. Babangida. Although
Abacha was ostensibly second in command to Babangida, nevertheless, Cheney,
along with Gen. Powell, arranged for Abacha to be given the highest U.S.
military award ever given to an officer of a foreign army.
Within due time after Abacha returned to Nigeria, this man - reputed to
be the mastermind behind several previous coups - initiated the seventh
coup in that country’s then 33-year history and imposed the most brutal
regime that Nigerians can recall. The prize again was oil.
The U.S. eventually was forced to publicly denounce Abacha and his
bloodthirsty oiligarchy, especially in the wake of the assassination
of Ken Saro-Wiwa and his eight other Ogoni activists. Saro-Wiwa and
his colleagues were murdered because of their leadership in leading
protests against the gross exploitation of their people and land by
the international oil cartel. While Abacha has since passed away, the
fact remains that the U.S. has shown little interest in helping the
new Nigerian government retrieve the $43 billion that their honoree
stole while he officiated over what has been called the “world’s largest
case of known government corruption [that] has exposed [the] weaknesses
in the international banking system’s regulation of money laundering.”
With all of this in mind, let us remember that Cheney, is the Chief
Executive Officer and Chairman of the world’s largest oil industry
server, the Halliburton company of Dallas, Texas. Halliburton is an
all-service multimillion dollar company that provides equipment and
arranges other assistance for companies that are engaged in oil and
natural gas exploration. Cheney’s Halliburton is also supportive of
petroleum company mergers and a major contributor to the Republican
Party".
-----
I think these are the kind of things Steve was talking about. Ya know
Brent
.I used to be a die hard republican because I believed in
conservative values and I believed in the "Republic". Things have
changed
.both sides are self-serving anymore. Oh sure, a little
humanitarian
work gets done here and there. A few do care
.then other times
it's just a show
.buys votes. Most real humanitarian work gets done
by the people
not our governments
.they just throw money at it.
If we cared (at the federal level) about farmers or energy, all that corn
that we over-produce every year and just rots/molds would be making ethanol.
South America is working hard at this
we aren't. Instead we sunsidize
the farmers
.it makes no sense but looks like they care.
We haven't created the infrastructure to support it because it threatens oil
so states like Kentucky are taking matters into their own hands and
doing
it themselves. You think Cheney cares more about Texas farmers than his
oil buddies? Texas=oil for him
.it's made him rich. Opening up the
Arctic National Wildlife Refuge for oil exploration isn't about honest
concerns over energy
.it's about black gold
.Texas Tea.
We need an Agrarian Party
.LOL. You've been around
.you can be
Secretary of State
.We could build our cabinet from the cast of
characters we have here
.LOL
.(just trying to end this on a light note.
Again, I can see both sides.)
peace.mark
. .
| Message 3
Subject: Re: Gar
From: Jim
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 05:09:01 -0500
Hi Roy,
Were in N MS are you located?
Jim.
(Commuting to Memphis [FedEx] daily.)
Roy Houston wrote:
>
> C
>
> Around here (northern MS) most people don't throw them back, but rather
> shove the nose into the sand or rocks so that they will die. One less bait stealer they
claim.
> Roy
>
> >So, how do they taste? (and are the fillets boneless?) As a kid, if
> >we caught a gar, we always "threw them back" (into the water). My Dad
> >didn't like them, so I never tasted one
. .
| Message 4
Subject: Re: Gar
From: Jim
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 07:23:11 -0500
The fish commonly found discarded on riverbanks around here are
longnose gar (Lepisosteus osseus) (state record 34 lb.)
Sounds like Roy's heard stories mixed up about several varieties of N.MS
'Trash' fish
Preparing Gar is more like dressing a snake than a
Y-boned carp. In my fishing experience, Gar don't so much steal bait as
ruin artificial lures
And it's almost impossible to remove a hook from
their boney snout without slicing a finger
You can slice them down the
back and remove 2 long strips of meat which are good if cut them into
chunks and quick-fry after soaking in crawfish mix (spicey!)
This fish is also commonly (erroneously) referred to as an alligator
gar by people who havn't
actually seen the real thing, which is sort of like calling a striped
tabbie a tiger. ;)
Jim
Longnose gar:
http://www.utexas.edu/depts/tnhc/.www/fish/tnhc/na/lepisost/lepisost/losseus_/losseus1.jpg
Alligator Gar:
http://www.delrio.com/~kimo1/images/wkbf5.jpg
Robert Rogers wrote:
>
> I disagree, have you tried them yourself, no "Y "bones no "hair" bones,
> this is personal experiance. My Father threw them back too, but had never
> eaten one, I have. Please try things for yourself
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roy Houston"
> To: "Aquaponics List"
> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 9:35 AM
> Subject: Gar
>
> > Carolyn:
> >
> > I would basically forget gar. The reason your dad threw them back is that
> > they are full of bones
. lots and lots of hair like bones. Taste is
> pretty
> > unspectacular also.
> >
> > Around here (northern MS) most people don't throw them back, but rather
> > shove the nose into the sand or rocks so that they will die. One less
> bait
> > stealer they claim.
> >
> > As far as growth, they do grow enormous. About once a year somebody will
> > catch one around here that is 5-6 feet long. Pretty prehistoric looking
> > fish if you ask me.> >
> > Roy
> >
> >
> > >So, how do they taste? (and are the fillets boneless?) As a kid, if
> > >we caught a gar, we always "threw them back" (into the water). My Dad
> > >didn't like them, so I never tasted one
> >
. .
| Message 5
Subject: Re: vortex filters / hydrocyclones
From: Ian Franzmann
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 23:58:31 +1000
Hi Arlos
I found this site useful for vortex filter information. Last access March
1999 just checked still exists. Good diagrams.
http://www.bahnhof.se/~grappo/metaphysics/Centripete.html
Ian
. .
| Message 6
Subject: RE: air and bacteria (small systems)
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 09:26:27 -0500 (CDT)
Mark I have another day off so I will answer some mail, the last few
days have been a bit long on the work load I couldn't even get home to
the wife.
You asked about a visit in the fall something that I think we should
all be doing If we get a chance maybe we could set some up with one
another or start a sort of regional get together It is a good Idea
Bruce
. .
| Message 7
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 10:09:20 -0500
> Subject: Re: Pest Control: Irish Spring, "Cedar" (Juniper), & Citrus
> From: pablo obiaga
> Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 04:38:25 -0300
>
> Ted:
> Where can I find info on the process of making this orange rind extract=
> "Citri-cide"
>
> I have a cuple of guys down here trying to figure out what to do to
dispose=
> several tons of orange and lemon peel a dirty industry is piling up
every=
> week (stupid thing to do, but some people think doing nothing is cheaper=
> and worthier).
>
> I had thout in a percentage of it entering pac=FA feed. But its only a
tini=
> amount, and there is still pallatability possible probs.
>
> Now, extract sold as organic insectifuge can prove worthy and make it
easier=
> to dipose dryier or the modifyied remains.
>
> Pablo
>
> Pablo,
> At a large orange juice plant here they first extract the peel oil (before
> squeezing the orange), which sells for very high dollars. After squeezing
> out the juice they run peals, seeds, and pulp through a grinder, then run
it
> through a waste heat drier and made into cattle feed. Very popular stuff -
> their entire production is sold years in advance.
>
> Jay
Pablo, I believe the active ingredients (pest repellent compounds in citrus
rind) may be soluble in alcohol, so it might be "fruitful" to consult with a
chemist that specializes in natural product chemistry. I believe you live
in Brazil, where I understand there is much ethanol production from sugar
cane, or once was. So, perhaps an ethanol extract of the rind might prove
effective as an extraction process. Supercritical fluid extraction with
very high pressure carbon dioxide is also a possibility (this is used to
de-caffeinate coffee), but it has been years since I have done such things
in the laboratory, and I know that the equipment is expensive.
Speaking of coffee, I know that they grow an "awful lot of coffee in
Brazil". But, I would recommend that anyone who cares about freedom,
justice, and politics consider the fact that ?Vietnam is Number 2 in the
world in coffee exports. In other words, Brazilian coffee is much more
appealing to me now that ever before. However, I mostly drink Ruta Maya
coffee from the Yuccatan, or maybe Community Coffee from
hmm
guess I
better check on the country of origin on my Community Coffee, eh?
Hope this helps.
Ted
. .
| Message 8
Subject: Re: Water Water everywhere.From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 10:17:06 -0500 (CDT)
Arlos It would be nice if I could have worked under you for a while
instead of me turning to driving oh well. On another subject I would
like to build a series of good looking Aquatic,Aquaponic, display type
systems similar to what is in the Zoos and national Aquariums but
smaller how do you form the backgrounds are they fiber glass over
plywood ? what should I use ?
Bruce
. .
| Message 9
Subject: Re: water chemistry.From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 11:24:24 -0500 (CDT)
Marc could iron fixing bacteria be converting things in your system as a
food source into iron like the bog iron used by the Vikings gotten in
peat bogs to make tools.? Their iron was not mined mineral but was
collected from under peat in the form of stones of bacterial origins and
they then smelted metal from it.
Bruce
. .
| Message 10
Subject: Re: Water Water everywhere.From: "Arlos"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 09:42:40 -0700
Bruce,
Do you want to build the rock work seen in the the ground of an exhibit?
If so there are synthetic concrete formulas to use. Lift small forms to
practice using a two part latex and a release. Earlier work like the
Matterhorn at Disneyland is probably the ultimate in synthetic rock work as
it has to withstand wind, quakes, mechanical stress and hydraulic pressure
and has done very well considering it was installed in the 50's. My wife has
been beating me to build her a new outdoor shower using a synthetic rock
wall. Smaller pieces can use chopped fiberglass as reinforcement and or
monofiliment line. Vermiculite and aluminum oxide can be added to reduce
weight by 60% and there are light weight concretes to work with. If there
are to be used in an aquarium you can seed them insitu for a year to
establish corals, algae, bacteria, etc
You can cast small voids to add
coral plugs This was done for the Monterey Bay Aquarium and Macrosystis
(giant Kelp) was added. As it tends to grow around 1 ft per day and gas
forms at the base of the blades, it kind of floated away and danced on the
bottom and broke up. we did manage to find pieces of it over about a 1/2
mile. considering the piece had weighed several hundred pounds, it kind of
suprised everyone involved. Molds are tricky to build for the someone just
starting out as it takes some practice to know where to place parting lines
and what material to use for negative spaces. Voids can be worked with if
using a flex mold with a ridgid back as to not deflect the final piece
You can build pipe and conduit into you forms and rebar if large enough.
It can be finished with a variety of acid washes, minerals and patinas or
washed with a mix of buttermilk and lichens/ moss to seed the rock. there
are a number of honeycombs polymers (my favorite) that add substantial
strength to a form without the added weight of rebar.
I'm going to do some upgrades including a new Sony digital instead of this
Samsung doorstop of an excuse for a camera. I still haven't forgotten about
posting the Aeration tower photos. I have to retake them with another
digital. I have a scanner but its not worth the time and effort with it. If
time and money were not an issue, stereo lithography would be the way to go
as you could develope rockwork from a digital image onto a foam base without
the expense of lifting a form in the field and transporting it back to a
shop.
If you have your own truck and a flatbed, you're way ahead of the game. I
sold my '76 1 1/2 ton dodge last year as I was tired of having the
transmission self distruct yearly. I'm eyeballing a new ISUZU NPR by the end
of the year. I have to haul treatment equipment to sights and right now
having it delivered is getting expensive. I have no idea how you owner
operators make any money especially if you are contract haulers and end up
having a deadhead on the way home. No wonder you work so many hours. I hope
to God NAFTA does not permit (wait I can't say this, Paula will rap my
nuckles with a ruler =) ) My only truck driving experience came when I was
a volunteer firefighter in the early 90's and became a FF2 which included
driving. Most drivers are pretty heads up when it comes to emergency
vehicles ut occasionally there is always someone so absorbed to not notice
the big red truck with lights behind them.I can't believe the danger drivers
put you guys in if they only knew what the braking distance a fully loaded
40' trailer is. Riding to Idaho twice this year and getting passed (opposite
direction) by a triple in Nevada just about pealed me off my bike. Farmers
like truckers
if people only knew they are the artery that feeds the
nation (world).
Sorry for the digression, email me off line for more info on the
environment construction including tank work
. It can get a little off
topic for the group.
Arlos
-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Schreiber
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Sunday, August 19, 2001 8:17 AM
Subject: Re: Water Water everywhere.
Arlos It would be nice if I could have worked under you for a while
instead of me turning to driving oh well. On another subject I would
like to build a series of good looking Aquatic,Aquaponic, display type
systems similar to what is in the Zoos and national Aquariums but
smaller how do you form the backgrounds are they fiber glass over
plywood ? what should I use ?
Bruce
. .
| Message 11
Subject: Re: Politics
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 12:26:12 -0500 (CDT)
Leslie It seams that we think alike. I almost went over to Rodesia to
join up in the last civil war.I bet I do in the next one. My family has
hosted 3 exchange students from Rodesia during that war.It's worse
there then is reported in our press .I think that soon there will be a
population drop due to Aids to help the white farmers as I am sure you
know its quietly cleaning the field.
In some areas all that's left are the old grandparents and the young
kids with the normal reproductive ages dead from Aids their kids also
have it and will die but being teenagers they keep screwing infecting
more and the old folks will die out naturally so it should be a clean
field but in the interim all hell can break out
50 years from now Africa will I think be peopled by only strict
Muslims,and very conservative Christians among the blacks with plenty of
room for us white farming types . Aids is like one of the plagues that
that the ILLI of Sumer used to kill out the sons of the Adam when they
got to numerous and started crowding the ILLI out to them the word Sin
meant reproduction .
Bruce
. .
| Message 12
Subject: Re: Politics
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 12:29:18 -0500 (CDT)
Oh shit I thought I sent that last one to leslie Oupps
Bruce
. .
| Message 13
Subject: Re: Bruce and ebola
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 12:45:52 -0500 (CDT)
Carolyn after I had what 3 hours of sleep I had a caffine pill to get me
going until sun up my normal if you can call it that routien what do you
want to talk about with ebola etc.
Bruce
. .
| Message 14
Subject: Re: Ever tasted bowfin?
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 12:48:14 -0500 (CDT)
Go with the dog fish and carp
. .
| Message 15
Subject: Real military aid
From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 14:44:17 EDT
In a message dated 8/19/01 12:09:17 AM Central Daylight Time,
aquaponics-digest-request 'at' townsqr.com writes:
<< We cannot send an army with
guns to guard every nomadic group wandering looking for food can we ?
Brent >>
******************************************************************************
********
Brent,
Why cant we do that ? Because the president is more interested in a tax cut
for the wealthy and in building a " missile shield" ( which will likely not
work) because wealthy Republicans get wealthier on the defense contracts.
We are already spending nearly half the money spent on military in the whole
damn world. Trouble is where we spend it. It will take a whole lot of
citizens telling government what we really want the military to do to change
things.
Regards,
Dave
. .
| Message 16
Subject: Re: Real military aid
From: "Arlos"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 16:09:44 -0700
This really is a thread for off the board but I'll throw my two sense in.
the nature of warfare has changed and the likelihood we'll ever have a need
for a missile defense shield is a little absurd but public fears can fund a
lot these days. Wars have become regional conflicts, testing grounds for
low intensity conflict. i had a chance to go on assignment to Kosavo about 2
years ago for 11 months to rebuild water and waste treatment plants but
things were so bad even mass graves were mined. The UN halted all civilian
contruction going in. I have no idea where things are today in the region?
for some reason it doesn't make for good sound bites right now???
Mission specialists to be inserted against civilian foreign nationals
(drugs) is a little out of line with national defense policies. Since we
germinated the industry to begin with, its absurd to think we should destroy
another nation over poorly executed policy. If we can't stop people from
waltzing across the border what makes us think we can set up a large beach
umbrella to ward off bottle rockets?Turning Pablo Escobar from a pig farmer
into the Bill Gates of cocaine and not reacting until it becomes a
profitable proposition is absurd. Poor Columbia (if anyone knows or has met
Colombians, they are a great, warm gracious people (ok, so a little
excitable but fun) as are all south Americans I've had a chance to know and
work with) has been all but ravaged by standing by and letting this fester
untill not only drugs but communist (para military thugs) have an iron grip.
china has always been an isolationist culture except for the real estate
purchase of closed US air bases along the Canal zone? Japanese making salt
on the Baja makes me nervous. the Russians are so broke they're selling E
ticket rides into space. Its easier to help another prune a bad graft before
the forest is destroyed. United Fruit is a whole other thread to get into
here
I'm not so sure about us anymore after watching Jay lenos
"Jaywalking" segments especially when the president can forgive Germany for
bombing Pearl Harbor. All in all, a full bowl of rice, a taste of middle
class life and political ideals don't seem so appealing anymore.
Is there anything we can do, probably, growing food at home with
aquaponics can most likely stop hunger everywhere. Its an ideal but one that
works
at nearly 50, I'm not marching off to anyones war anymore A year
in Viet Nam was enough to tell me war is BS and nothing but $$$ driven,
that's why you can't draft 45 year olds Try and get a room full of them up
at 5 AM and you're most likely to get hit over the head with a flying
object
.youth on the other hand
Arlos
-----Original Message-----
From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Sunday, August 19, 2001 11:44 AM
Subject: Real military aid
>In a message dated 8/19/01 12:09:17 AM Central Daylight Time,
>aquaponics-digest-request 'at' townsqr.com writes:
>
><< We cannot send an army with
> guns to guard every nomadic group wandering looking for food can we ?
> Brent >>
>***************************************************************************
***
>
>********
>Brent,
>Why cant we do that ? Because the president is more interested in a tax cut
>for the wealthy and in building a " missile shield" ( which will likely not
>work) because wealthy Republicans get wealthier on the defense contracts.
>We are already spending nearly half the money spent on military in the
whole
>damn world. Trouble is where we spend it. It will take a whole lot of
>citizens telling government what we really want the military to do to
change
>things.
>Regards,
>Dave
>
. .
| Message 17
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 13:37:02 -1000
aloha, tgtx
.being a gourmet coffee grower in hawaii
brazil is the world's
largest coffee producer, their coffee being known as 'rio', verses other
'arabica' coffees as 'mild'
.viet nam is not number 2, and they primarily
raise 'robusta', fact is, china sends vn their coffee to be
marketed
.coffee is the second most traded commodity in the world, next to
oil, africa, kenya AA does its fair share, as does other african countries,
when a chlorine extraction is made to make decaf, for the soda industry, it
is evaporated at 200 F, as you brew the coffee, the swiss water method is
just another way
.if you drink high elevation gourmet coffee, you won't get
the shakes nor the high caffiene content
.cowboy
>From: "TGTX"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
>Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 10:09:20 -0500
>
> > Subject: Re: Pest Control: Irish Spring, "Cedar" (Juniper), & Citrus
> > From: pablo obiaga
> > Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 04:38:25 -0300
> >
> > Ted:
> > Where can I find info on the process of making this orange rind extract=
> > "Citri-cide"
> >
> > I have a cuple of guys down here trying to figure out what to do to
>dispose=
> > several tons of orange and lemon peel a dirty industry is piling up
>every=
> > week (stupid thing to do, but some people think doing nothing is
>cheaper=
> > and worthier).
> >
> > I had thout in a percentage of it entering pac=FA feed. But its only a
>tini=
> > amount, and there is still pallatability possible probs.
> >
> > Now, extract sold as organic insectifuge can prove worthy and make it
>easier=
> > to dipose dryier or the modifyied remains.
> >
> > Pablo
> >
> > Pablo,
> > At a large orange juice plant here they first extract the peel oil
>(before
> > squeezing the orange), which sells for very high dollars. After
>squeezing
> > out the juice they run peals, seeds, and pulp through a grinder, then
>run
>it
> > through a waste heat drier and made into cattle feed. Very popular stuff
>-
> > their entire production is sold years in advance.
> >
> > Jay
>
>Pablo, I believe the active ingredients (pest repellent compounds in citrus
>rind) may be soluble in alcohol, so it might be "fruitful" to consult with
>a
>chemist that specializes in natural product chemistry. I believe you live
>in Brazil, where I understand there is much ethanol production from sugar
>cane, or once was. So, perhaps an ethanol extract of the rind might prove
>effective as an extraction process. Supercritical fluid extraction with
>very high pressure carbon dioxide is also a possibility (this is used to
>de-caffeinate coffee), but it has been years since I have done such things
>in the laboratory, and I know that the equipment is expensive.
>
>Speaking of coffee, I know that they grow an "awful lot of coffee in
>Brazil". But, I would recommend that anyone who cares about freedom,
>justice, and politics consider the fact that ?Vietnam is Number 2 in the
>world in coffee exports. In other words, Brazilian coffee is much more
>appealing to me now that ever before. However, I mostly drink Ruta Maya
>coffee from the Yuccatan, or maybe Community Coffee from
hmm
guess
>I
>better check on the country of origin on my Community Coffee, eh?
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Ted
>
. .
| Message 18
Subject: Re: Real military aid
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 13:52:43 -1000
gee dave, join the dnc with their bs hype, are you a socialist, or worse? do
you like big brother watching for your needs, common sense tells you to put
a seat belt on, but there is a law, bye-bye another freedom
.duh
.stick to
aquaponics, you will lose in any political debate
.without free enterprise,
socialism cannot exist
.try going and living in various countries, then get
back to me
.impress me by providing for your own needs and others, and
showing a profit, and expanding to feed 100,000 people your way, then you
will prove yourself
.bet you think peace corps works, want to go to fresno,
ca and see the walking dead from peace corps? no cure
.oops, not suppose to
tell
cowboy
>From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Real military aid
>Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 14:44:17 EDT
>
>In a message dated 8/19/01 12:09:17 AM Central Daylight Time,
>aquaponics-digest-request 'at' townsqr.com writes:
>
><< We cannot send an army with
> guns to guard every nomadic group wandering looking for food can we ?
> Brent >>
>******************************************************************************
>
>********
>Brent,
>Why cant we do that ? Because the president is more interested in a tax cut
>for the wealthy and in building a " missile shield" ( which will likely not
>work) because wealthy Republicans get wealthier on the defense contracts.
>We are already spending nearly half the money spent on military in the
>whole
>damn world. Trouble is where we spend it. It will take a whole lot of
>citizens telling government what we really want the military to do to
>change
>things.
>Regards,
>Dave
. .
| Message 19
Subject: Military
From: "Steven Medlock"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 19:40:16 -0500
I can't stay out of this one. I spent my time in many different countries,
and in Desert Storm and Shield. The bottom line is it is time that the rest
of the so called free world take care of there own backyard problems. They
do a fine job telling us how stupid we are, but don't mind killing our
people, and letting us cough up the bill.
Red
. .
| Message 20
Subject: failing on tomatos
From: "Steven Medlock"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 19:44:45 -0500
I have got fantastic looking plants, and am still loosing 80 persent of my
blooms. The humidity is no worse than it is outside. The bees have done
nothing. I have went to hand pollinating and am still having no luck.
Should I go with a Plant that is made for a greenhouse. Otherwise I have to
come up with another idea.
Thanks,
Red
. .
| Message 21
Subject: Off-Topic posts re: Politics, Military or whatever other
divisive topic you want to call it
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 19:55:42 -0500
Meaning no disrespect for any individual, country, or group -- I'd
appreciate your moving these types of posts off-list. Actually, if we are
to remain persons with a common interest, it would probably be best not
discussing at all. As interesting as it can be to discover the
multi-faceted persons we are (as opposed to only an aquaponics personality),
I think we're running very close to causing some serious rifts to the group;
and that seems counter-productive to me considering that the purpose of the
list is sharing information concerning "our" subject.
I'd like to just let this one run itself out, as others seem to, but I sense
we're touching some very sensitive areas. So
let's reconverge on our
purpose. Our respective governments seem to be doing enough damage to world
relations -- no need for us to help things along there.
I appreciate each of you on this group -- don't want to lose anyone :>)
This does not mean that I don't have an interest in what's going on in the
world, or feel the need to be of service to those in need. Anyone who wants
to address how best to spread aquaponics to help solve world food production
problems is welcome to introduce the subject
.oh, I forgot, that probably
IS the main subject.
Paula
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
. .
| Message 22
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
From: "Arlos"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 18:00:17 -0700
Gerry,
You happen to raise cacao trees when you were growing coffee? Do any
companion planting, raising bananas? Whats with the quarantine on Hawaiian
bananas? Was coffee that profitable to raise on the Kona coast? Seemed every
backyard had coffee trees in them. Sheesh, a lot of questions, eh?
Arlos
-----Original Message-----
From: gerry magnuson
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Date: Sunday, August 19, 2001 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
>aloha, tgtx
.being a gourmet coffee grower in hawaii
brazil is the
world's
>largest coffee producer, their coffee being known as 'rio', verses other
>'arabica' coffees as 'mild'
.viet nam is not number 2, and they primarily
>raise 'robusta', fact is, china sends vn their coffee to be
>marketed
.coffee is the second most traded commodity in the world, next to
>oil, africa, kenya AA does its fair share, as does other african countries,
>when a chlorine extraction is made to make decaf, for the soda industry, it
>is evaporated at 200 F, as you brew the coffee, the swiss water method is
>just another way
.if you drink high elevation gourmet coffee, you won't
get
>the shakes nor the high caffiene content
.cowboy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>From: "TGTX"
>>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>>
>>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Sat 08/18/01
>>Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 10:09:20 -0500
>>
>> > Subject: Re: Pest Control: Irish Spring, "Cedar" (Juniper), & Citrus
>> > From: pablo obiaga
>> > Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 04:38:25 -0300
>> >
>> > Ted:
>> > Where can I find info on the process of making this orange rind
extract=
>> > "Citri-cide"
>> >
>> > I have a cuple of guys down here trying to figure out what to do to
>>dispose=
>> > several tons of orange and lemon peel a dirty industry is piling up
>>every=
>> > week (stupid thing to do, but some people think doing nothing is
>>cheaper=
>> > and worthier).
>> >
>> > I had thout in a percentage of it entering pac=FA feed. But its only a
>>tini=
>> > amount, and there is still pallatability possible probs.
>> >
>> > Now, extract sold as organic insectifuge can prove worthy and make it
>>easier=
>> > to dipose dryier or the modifyied remains.
>> >
>> > Pablo
>> >
>> > Pablo,
>> > At a large orange juice plant here they first extract the peel oil
>>(before
>> > squeezing the orange), which sells for very high dollars. After
>>squeezing
>> > out the juice they run peals, seeds, and pulp through a grinder, then
>>run
>>it
>> > through a waste heat drier and made into cattle feed. Very popular
stuff
>>-
>> > their entire production is sold years in advance.
>> >
>> > Jay
>>
>>Pablo, I believe the active ingredients (pest repellent compounds in
citrus
>>rind) may be soluble in alcohol, so it might be "fruitful" to consult with
>>a
>>chemist that specializes in natural product chemistry. I believe you live
>>in Brazil, where I understand there is much ethanol production from sugar
>>cane, or once was. So, perhaps an ethanol extract of the rind might prove
>>effective as an extraction process. Supercritical fluid extraction with
>>very high pressure carbon dioxide is also a possibility (this is used to
>>de-caffeinate coffee), but it has been years since I have done such things
>>in the laboratory, and I know that the equipment is expensive.
>>
>>Speaking of coffee, I know that they grow an "awful lot of coffee in
>>Brazil". But, I would recommend that anyone who cares about freedom,
>>justice, and politics consider the fact that ?Vietnam is Number 2 in the
>>world in coffee exports. In other words, Brazilian coffee is much more
>>appealing to me now that ever before. However, I mostly drink Ruta Maya
>>coffee from the Yuccatan, or maybe Community Coffee from
hmm
guess
>>I
>>better check on the country of origin on my Community Coffee, eh?
>>
>>Hope this helps.
>>
>>Ted
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
. .
| Message 23
Subject: Fwd. Aquaponics question (Non-profit)
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 21:04:33 -0500
Any response to this inquiry? I have promised to forward any information
sent to the group, but have also suggested that Tyler join the group in
order to have best access to our pool of information.
Paula
--
>Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 18:28:39 -0700
>From: trb20
>To:
>Subject: Aquaponics question (Non-profit)
>
>Hello Speraneos,
>I am a Co-director of the Campus Center for Appropriate Technology(CCAT), a
>501 c3 live-in demostration home for appropriate technologies in Arcata, CA.
>We are currently developing a small scale aquaponic system strictly for
>education/demostration purposes. We have a greenhouse where the bio-filters
>could be placed, however our fish tank is planned to be an outdoor open pond
>fed by rainwater from cisterns. Can you recommend any references that have
>explored aquaponics with fish other than tilapia in an outdoor pond. CCAT
>would greatly appreciate your advice and expertise.
>
>Thank you for your time,
>Tyler R. Brandenburg
>CCAT Co-director
>(707)826-3551
>trb20 'at' humboldt.edu
. .
| Message 24
Subject: Assorted resources
From: S & S Aqua Farm
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 21:40:33 -0500
Below is a listing of several notices or announcements I've received over
the past week or so that may be of interest to some of you. I'll summarize
the information here, but would be glad to post the full notice of any of
them to anyone who wants it. Just let me know at
Paula
-----
From: Eric Gibson
Publisher/Co-Author "The New Farmers' Market" & "Sell What You Sow!"
www.nwpub.net
>I am working on a new book, "Grower's Guide to the Internet" and would
>appreciate any contacts (emails, url's, phone #'s) of anyone using the
>internet in the small farm/sustainable arena in a successful or unique way
----
>OPERATORS OF AQUATIC ANIMAL PRODUCTION FACILITIES (PRIVATE, PUBLIC AND
>RESEARCH)
>
>EPA SCREENER QUESTIONNAIRE FOR INFORMATION COLLECTION REQUEST
>
>August 9, 2001
>From:
>Gary Jensen, Chair
>JSA Aquaculture Effluents Task Force
>USDA Cooperative State Research, Education and Extension Service
>
>Purpose
>This notice provides information on understanding EPA's Collection of 2000
>Aquatic Animal Production Industry Data process, why you may receive a
>Screener Questionnaire (short survey), how the collected information may be
>used, and why this Screener Questionnaire is important in the rulemaking
>process to develop proposed national effluent limitations guidelines for
>aquaculture facilities.
A post from:
Dr. A. David Scarfe PhD, DVM, MRSSA
DScarfe 'at' avma.org
Assist. Director, Scientific Activities
American Veterinary Medical Association
Visit our website: www.avma.org
>A very useful site for reviewing US aquaculture drugs, vaccines and
>pesticides can be found at
>http://ag.ansc.purdue.edu/aquanic/publicat/govagen/usda/gdvp.htm
-
>From Michael Schwarz
Information on the publication from the Flatfish session Held at WAS 2000 in
New Orleans, LA
AND
the fourth annual flatfish symposia scheduled for the WAS 2002 meeting in
San Diego, CA.
-----
>>USGS Launches New Web Site for Nation's Water Data
>>
>>The U.S. Geological Survey (USGS), this week, launched its new, online
>>National Water Information System (NWISWeb) and in so doing opened the
>>doors to the public to much more of the 100 years of water data collected
>>by the federal earth science agency. The new website, found at:
>>http://water.usgs.gov/nwis/ allows users to access several hundred million
>>pieces of archival and real-time data---all from their home or office
>>computers.\
-
A series of posts from From: DrDaveFFO 'at' aol.com -- topics are:
Report on dioxins in catfish.
US Seafood Consumption Up Again
Russian Aquaculture Potential
Pollution found to be reduced with vege-protein fish diets
Seafood Restaurant Successes
Fish Farm Insurance
Law to label farm fish origin
---
A notice from the US Fish and Wildlife Service:
North American Wetlands Conservation Act (NAWCA) Small Grants
>>Funding for Contracts, Equipment or Materials Acquisition or Facility Use
>>and Research are encouraged.
-
A notice from: "IBSnet: General Forum on Integrated Bio-Systems"
regarding [IBS-GEN] ecological sanitation conf.
1st Intl Conf. on Ecological
Sanitation which will take place from 5-8 Nov in Nanning, PR China. Further
announcements on the
electronic extension of the Conference will be made via the IBSnet Announcement
list ET-ANN
--
And a hydroponic news resource that I find very interesting, with all types
of good information pulled from various sources (some of our "own"
publications included):
HYDRO1 - FREE Newsletter published by Bob Saffell, Editor/Publisher
mailto:bsaffell 'at' mayhillpress.com
details for subscribing at the website: http://www.mayhillpress.com
--
Finally - two notices from Steve Diver at ATTRA concerning:
1) What: Sustainable Livestock Production Workshop
Where: Fayetteville, Arkansas
When: October 15-17, 2001
Who: NCAT, ATTRA, NRCS, Farmers
What: Systems approach to grazing management
2) Subject: Pastured Poultry - An HPI Case Study Booklet
----
Let me know at if you want further details, and I'll
forward the entire posts.
Paula
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
. .
| Message 25
Subject: Re: failing on tomatos
From: pantryman 'at' empireone.net
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 21:50:24 -0500
Red
Have you taken any tissue tests to see exactly what is going on with your plants? I suspect a
nutrient deficiency of potassium or an imbalance of nitrogen which may be making your tomatoes
spontaneously
abort their flowers.
Bob
"Steven Medlock" wrote:
>
> I have got fantastic looking plants, and am still loosing 80 persent of my
> blooms. The humidity is no worse than it is outside. The bees have done
> nothing. I have went to hand pollinating and am still having no luck.
> Should I go with a Plant that is made for a greenhouse. Otherwise I have to
> come up with another idea.
> Thanks,
> Red
>
>
. .
| Message 26
Subject: Re: failing on tomatos - follow up
From: pantryman 'at' empireone.net
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 22:15:08 -0500
Red.You may also want to check for an iron deficiency. I realize this is discouraging to you right
now,
but you have a golden opportunity to discover something about your system. You said you have
fantastic looking plants
is there any yellowing of the leaves?
Hang in there Red
.go through the basics: ph, macroelements and whatever you have equipment
to test for.Bob
"Steven Medlock" wrote:
>
> I have got fantastic looking plants, and am still loosing 80 persent of my
> blooms. The humidity is no worse than it is outside. The bees have done
> nothing. I have went to hand pollinating and am still having no luck.
> Should I go with a Plant that is made for a greenhouse. Otherwise I have to
> come up with another idea.
> Thanks,
> Red
>
>
. .
| Message 27
Subject: Re: failing on tomatos - follow up
From: "gutierrez-lagatta"
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 23:23:03 -0500
For about $30 you can send leaf samples to Scott's testing
laboratories for analysis
.let me know if you want specific info.
Adriana
> You may also want to check for an iron deficiency. I realize this is
discouraging to you right now,
> but you have a golden opportunity to discover something about your
system. You said you have
> fantastic looking plants
is there any yellowing of the leaves?
> Hang in there Red
.go through the basics: ph, macroelements and
whatever you have equipment
> to test for.
|
