Aquaponics Digest - Thu 09/06/01
Message 1: Tank shapes
from "Leslie Ter Morshuizen"
Message 2: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 3: Re: Please Help
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 4: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
from BMac1978
Message 5: Re: Please Help
from Andrei Calciu
Message 6: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
from Mick
Message 7: Re: Aquaponics heat exchangers and collectors
from marc
Message 8: Re: Please Help
from "Louis N. Scerbo"
Message 9: Re: Please Help
from "Louis N. Scerbo"
Message 10: stainless steel
from Arlus Farnsworth
Message 11: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
from DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
Message 12: Re: Please Help
from Andrei Calciu
Message 13: Re: Please Help
from Mick
Message 14: Re: Water Water everywhere. from Arlus Farnsworth
Message 15: Re: Please Help
from kris book
Message 16: RE: Please Help
from "Ron Brooks"
Message 17: Re: Please Help
from BMac1978
Message 18: boiler copper
from "Steven Medlock"
Message 19: Re: boiler copper
from Arlus Farnsworth
Message 20: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 21: Re: Please Help
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 22: Re: Please Help
from "Thomas Short"
Message 23: Re: Please Help
from "Thomas Short"
Message 24: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 25: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
from "Thomas Short"
Message 26: Re: Please Help
from "Chris Jeppesen"
Message 27: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 28: Re: Please Help
from "Thomas Short"
Message 29: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 30: Re: Please Help
from "gerry magnuson"
Message 31: Re: Please Help
from (Bruce Schreiber)
| Message 1
Subject: Tank shapes
From: "Leslie Ter Morshuizen"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 08:12:10 +0200
Hi
The main advantage offered by square tanks is the better space utilisation
afforded by being able to pack the tanks against each other without having
the significant proportion of void space between tanks that occurs when
round tanks are used. Make your selection according to the value of the
floor space and the characteristics of species being produced. In an
outdoor system use round tanks as the cost of floor area is low, whereas in
a tunnel or hatchery it is high. If water space is more important than
water quality then use square tanks, if water quality is the primary factor
use round tanks. In an attempt to strike a compromise between the two
systems some farmers use square tanks with rounded corners, providing
increased water volume/space utilisation relative to a round tanks and
increased flushing efficiency relative to square tanks.
Regards,
Leslie
Howdy all,
Round tanks are usually favored because of the "self-cleaning"
aspects. Dead areas in square tanks (the corners) contribute to poor water
quality, and can be a good way to stress your fish and develop various and
sundry diseases. This of course is also dependent on the type of
fish. There are some species that are more resistant to poor environmental
conditions. These species would still probably grow better if offered
superior water quality.
Carl
| Message 2
Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:20:03 -1000
luv the great responses, thank you all, getting back to basics
.as to the
copper with the fish, I beleive the young lady was talking about a 'heat
exchange' system, and many failed to understand, not a teacher, the 55
gallon tub was part of the exchange system, the coil of copper goes into the
tub, and the water heated in the tub, is used to go into the fish
tanks
sheesh
.whomever added that radiant heat site, thank you
.great
info all
.cowboy
>From: (Bruce Schreiber)
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
>Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2001 23:25:56 -0500 (CDT)
>
>Gerry all that I can tell you is that with my own 30 years of fish
>breeding experiences and the combined experience of my fellow top level
>Aquarians and hatchery operators that total around 1000 years of
>experience .COPPER is at best a medication used carefully and at worst a
>sure wipe out used to poison some ones system that you don't like
>because you want him to fail.
> When you draw water from a copper piped potable system you must let it
>run long enough to flush out the copper that might be be in
>solution(over night buildup) before filling a fish containing system or
>you will get a build up in the system killing the fish.(This is only
>magnifyed if you actually stupedly place copper in an inclosed fish
>system loop)
> Now it will not happen the first time or the tenth time BUT it will
>eventually build up to toxic levels.
> Its easy to tell when because the fish are all sort of dead looking
>and they taste kind of the way they smell. Ok now when that happens you
>take a sample of water to have it analyzed and you will be told that the
>copper is just a touch high OOPs!! you should have payed attention!
>But hey that's how I learned. actually that's how most of us learned
>that costly lesson. So now its your turn.
> Most systems go with circular tanks but race ways with staged
>levels each dropping in to the next level below works fine , you can
>play with the specie mix better and use surface hydroponics in it too!.
> Bruce
>
| Message 3
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 01:21:18 -1000
do I smell burning weeds?
>From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Please Help
>Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:16:14 -0400
>
> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
>more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
>first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>lighting in the winter anyway.
> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
> What about the humidity issue?
>
>Thank you all in advance for your help,
>Lou
>
| Message 4
Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: BMac1978
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 09:24:46 EDT
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In a message dated 9/5/2001 3:10:01 PM Central Daylight Time,
writes:
> I can tell you almost all the fish in my small koi pond died
>
So sorry to hear this happened, I think we can all learn from what happened
to you. If you have the choice during set up, stay clear of metals that come
in contact with the water, right? I know I am not going to take the chance
when I get my set up running.
Dawn
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In a message dated 9/5/2001 3:10:01 PM Central Daylight Time,
writes:
I can tell you almost all the fish in my small koi pond
died
this morning.
So sorry to hear this happened, I think we can all learn from what happened
to you. If you have the choice during set up, stay clear of metals that come
in contact with the water, right? I know I am not going to take the chance
when I get my set up running.
Dawn
--part1_ff.bb06f6f.28c8d31e_boundary--
| Message 5
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: Andrei Calciu
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 09:58:34 -0400
go to http://www.heatpipe.com they sell high performance dehumidifiers.
Instead of putting the water down the drain, you can have the dehumidifier
dump the water back in the fish tank.
You may also want to consider painting your basement in the brightest white
color you can find and possibly installing drywall (the humidity resistant
kind used in bathrooms - called blueboard, I think) on the ceiling of your
basement. This will keep the humidity from migrating upwards toward the
living space. Use oil based paints (they do not allow humidity to be
absorbed into the drywall. Coupled with a high performance dehumidifier,
you should be sitting in butter after that.
-_______________
Andrei D. Calciu (VA-4270)
NEC America, Inc.
14040 Park Center Dr.
Herndon, VA 20171-3227
Voice: 703-834-4273
Fax: 703-787-6613
This message and any attachment are confidential. If you are not the
intended recipient, please telephone or email the sender and delete the
message and any attachment from your system. If you are not the intended
recipient you must not copy this message or attachment or disclose the
contents to any other person.
| Message 6
Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: Mick
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 10:39:57 -0500
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> So sorry to hear this happened, I think we can all learn from what
> happened
> to you. If you have the choice during set up, stay clear of metals
> that come
> in contact with the water, right? I know I am not going to take the
> chance
> when I get my set up running.
>
> Dawn
-----
Dawn,
Staying clear of all metals is the safest way, as far as I'm concerned.
The screen that was installed in the goldfish pond appeared to be
stainless steel when the guys stupidly installed it. Looking at the
screen now, I can see that where the water came in contact with the
screen, the shine was eaten away and the underlying metal was a totally
different color. Who knows what the composition of that metal was
copper? lead? I have no idea how metal is smelted so to avoid having to
decide if a metal piece is safe or not, I just avoid all metal
problem
solved.
You can find plastic parts for your entire system, even the large
shutoff valves or water redirection valves.
As for winter heating, circulating water tends to have close to the same
temperature as the ambient air. We have commercial aqua heaters that
raise the water temp five degrees in our tanks. We used them this
spring with no problems. This winter, the plan is to make the
greenhouse/barn as air tight as possible and keep the air warm with
compost piles and an electric heater. We don't have many freezes in
South Texas, so I'm hoping this will keep the fish warm enough. If not,
I'll have to add more heaters to the tanks and my electric bill is not
gonna be pretty.
Best of luck with your new system. I hope you get it up and running
soon!
Mick
--750BE0B25DFC8F3AA44FFC89
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So sorry
to hear this happened, I think we can all learn from what happened
to you.
If you have the choice during set up, stay clear of metals that come
in contact
with the water, right? I know I am not going to take the chance
when
I get my set up running.
Dawn
-----
Dawn,
Staying clear of all metals is the safest way, as far as I'm concerned.
The screen that was installed in the goldfish pond appeared to be stainless
steel when the guys stupidly installed it. Looking at the screen
now, I can see that where the water came in contact with the screen, the
shine was eaten away and the underlying metal was a totally different color.
Who knows what the composition of that metal was
copper? lead?
I have no idea how metal is smelted so to avoid having to decide if a metal
piece is safe or not, I just avoid all metal
problem solved.
You can find plastic parts for your entire system, even the large shutoff
valves or water redirection valves.
As for winter heating, circulating water tends to have close to the
same temperature as the ambient air. We have commercial aqua heaters
that raise the water temp five degrees in our tanks. We used them
this spring with no problems. This winter, the plan is to make the
greenhouse/barn as air tight as possible and keep the air warm with compost
piles and an electric heater. We don't have many freezes in South
Texas, so I'm hoping this will keep the fish warm enough. If not,
I'll have to add more heaters to the tanks and my electric bill is not
gonna be pretty.
Best of luck with your new system. I hope you get it up and running
soon!
Mick
--750BE0B25DFC8F3AA44FFC89--
| Message 7
Subject: Re: Aquaponics heat exchangers and collectors
From: marc
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 12:22:40 -0600
> that all copper lines running propane are no good?
It is commonplace for copper lines to fail due to soil pH. I
have seen them fail in under a month both propane and water.
> using copper
> properly in a 55 gallon, plastic tub/barrel, to heat water in > the tub to be
> transferred to a fish or plant area is a no-no?
>It has been proven to work in nevada
Please share your results with us.
>
.not everyone has access to expensive solutions, as valuable as they may be, one can also
use cpvc
.I am at the commercial level, costs are very apparent at this stage,
If you choose to use cpvc you will have a lower heat
transfer rate compared to stainless. It is consistent with
laws of physics that cpvc is a better insulator than
stainless.
Lets start with a stainless steel system that works
perfectly.
Now let's pull out the stainless steel heat exchanger and
replace it with a cpvc one with the exact same dimensions.
You go on a road trip and get a call that your fish are
having problems. But why??
Since cpvc has a poorer heat exchange RATE than stainless it
could not transfer the heat to the aquaponics setup as fast
as the stainless could and the fish got cold.
Let's rebuild the cpvc exchanger to transfer the same amount
of heat as the stainless one. Pumping costs due to friction
loss will not be increased in a cpvc system if the
additional tubing is paralleled and/or pipe size increased.
The heat is transferred due to contact time and a slower
rate of flow will facilitate the additional contact time
needed for heat transfer in lots of additional paralleled
pipes.
It takes a LOT of additional tubing, bigger distribution
tubing and a MUCH wider barrel - a HUGE barrel! Lots of
sweat equity.
Let's price stainless
.not as expensive as one might think,
some stainless CAN be soldered so don't need those expensive
fittings, swaging tools so don't have to solder if there's a
lot to do. Lessee - what's my time worth?$
Later add things up and found we spent about the same as if
had used stainless in the first place. Bummer. Cpvc seemed
so cheap per foot at the hardware store.
In engineering there's a saying that "all parts are free".
It's kind of a perverse way of saying that you're going to
spend the money ANYWAY YOU DO IT so do it right in the first
place. If a reasonable approach is taken in design - parts
always seem to cost about the same for a given end result.
There's also the "rule of tens". It takes ten seconds to do
it fast, 100 seconds to do it right, ten minutes to figure
out why it won't work after it's done fast, 100 minutes to
repair it right, etc.
There's a matter of rational thought. If you don't have the
time or money to do it right then how can you expect your
results to be right? If you don't have the time or money to
do it right then when will you? If you don't have the time
or money to do it right in the first place then HOW IN THE
WORLD did you manage to do it over again??
Bottom line is if I use cheap parts they fail sooner or I
have to use more to get the same result as the expensive
ones so I spend the same.
An owner gets paid for "sweat equity" but sometimes it's
simply false economy as the stainless and cpvc would cost
the same MONEY anyway for the same heat transfer ability and
the owner would have saved time.
.purchase
.we are not rich folk in this industry, rather
seeking need
methods, and costs and simplicity are very real.
The methods and simplicity are basically the same. The
materials costs or perception of costs are what is the
issue.
Do a true future worth analysis based on GOOD HOMEWORK of
the technique you choose. What is it REALLY going to cost
for a given result?
| Message 8
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:23:05 -0400
Gerry
I must tell you that was a low shot. I know what you mean. and invite
anyone to come and check.
As a new subscriber to the list I hope you all are not like this.
My question was sincere. I have retired recently and have moved to PA
where I've purchased 16 acres where I hope to do all the things ie:
gardening, small scale husbandry, etc.
If you all don't want to help a guy just starting out just ignore my pot!!!!
Lou
gerry magnuson wrote:
> do I smell burning weeds?
>
>
>> From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
>> Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>> To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>> Subject: Please Help
>> Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:16:14 -0400
>>
>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
| Message 9
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:35:35 -0400
Thanks Andrei,
I've already done everything you suggested
The blueboard,ligt color and all.
I would like a little more specific info on how many fish to edible size
can I expect. How many trays can a 300 gal tank handle. I'd like to grow
tomatoes, greens, broccoli to start.
Lou
Andrei Calciu wrote:
>go to http://www.heatpipe.com they sell high performance dehumidifiers.
>Instead of putting the water down the drain, you can have the dehumidifier
>dump the water back in the fish tank.
>
>You may also want to consider painting your basement in the brightest white
>color you can find and possibly installing drywall (the humidity resistant
>kind used in bathrooms - called blueboard, I think) on the ceiling of your
>basement. This will keep the humidity from migrating upwards toward the
>living space. Use oil based paints (they do not allow humidity to be
>absorbed into the drywall. Coupled with a high performance dehumidifier,
>you should be sitting in butter after that.
>
>-_______________
>Andrei D. Calciu (VA-4270)
>NEC America, Inc.
>14040 Park Center Dr.
>Herndon, VA 20171-3227
>
>Voice: 703-834-4273
>Fax: 703-787-6613
>
>This message and any attachment are confidential. If you are not the
>intended recipient, please telephone or email the sender and delete the
>message and any attachment from your system. If you are not the intended
>recipient you must not copy this message or attachment or disclose the
>contents to any other person.
>
>
>
| Message 10
Subject: stainless steel
From: Arlus Farnsworth
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 11:35:37 -0700
ok, so there is a new laser welding process that can form strip
stainless steel and titanium into virtually seamless extremely clean
tubes at a lower price. Did not know that.
About stainless steel. Stainless steel is available in various grades
that consist of different alloy composition. Only certain grades are
suitable for food contact. In addition, there are different ways of
making tube that need to be considered. Tube is often manufactured with
lubricant that either is or is not cleaned. Some cleaning processes are
designed to meet food standards and others are not. Tubes are often
welded, laser welding and some other methods do not contribute to seam
corrosion. One manufacturer heat treats welded tubes to crystalize the
metal and significantly lessen corrosion. A type of tubing that seemed
appropriate and possibly cheap was called beverage tubing. I would check
the specs in any case.
Also, many dehumidifiers and air conditioning units use copper or
aluminum coils, if that is of concern.
| Message 11
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:41:25 EDT
In a message dated 9/5/01 12:09:51 AM Central Daylight Time,
aquaponics-digest-request 'at' townsqr.com writes:
<< Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2001 05:44:39 -1000
run copper coils on your roof, install a couple of backflow peventers, use a
grundfos pump, have the water pipes of copper coils submerged in a 55 gallon
drum to heat water to be put into the fish tanks
.forget your radiators,
not even good for making shine
. >>>
******************************************************************************
****
What is " a grundfos pump,"?
Regards,
Dave
| Message 12
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: Andrei Calciu
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:46:45 -0400
Louis,
at full grown size you should have about 150-200 fish (weight 1.5 to 2
pounds) in a 300 gallon tank. At that size you could probably support 1-2
grow beds of roughly 32 square feet each (4'x8' about 12" deep). What you
grow and how much you grow in these beds, and what shape and size you make
them, is pretty much up to you.
For example, you can build two beds 4x8 or two beds 2x16 or two beds 1x32,
or any combination thereof, just keep the depth to about 1 foot to give
room to your roots and have enough medium for the bacteria to live on.
Good luck.
-_______________
Andrei D. Calciu (VA-4270)
NEC America, Inc.
14040 Park Center Dr.
Herndon, VA 20171-3227
Voice: 703-834-4273
Fax: 703-787-6613
This message and any attachment are confidential. If you are not the
intended recipient, please telephone or email the sender and delete the
message and any attachment from your system. If you are not the intended
recipient you must not copy this message or attachment or disclose the
contents to any other person.
"Louis N. Scerbo"
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Sent by: cc:
aquaponics-request 'at' t Subject: Re: Please Help
ownsqr.com
09/06/01 02:35 PM
Please respond to
aquaponics
Thanks Andrei,
I've already done everything you suggested
The blueboard,ligt color and all.
I would like a little more specific info on how many fish to edible size
can I expect. How many trays can a 300 gal tank handle. I'd like to grow
tomatoes, greens, broccoli to start.
Lou
Andrei Calciu wrote:
>go to http://www.heatpipe.com they sell high performance dehumidifiers.
>Instead of putting the water down the drain, you can have the dehumidifier
>dump the water back in the fish tank.
>
>You may also want to consider painting your basement in the brightest
white
>color you can find and possibly installing drywall (the humidity resistant
>kind used in bathrooms - called blueboard, I think) on the ceiling of your
>basement. This will keep the humidity from migrating upwards toward the
>living space. Use oil based paints (they do not allow humidity to be
>absorbed into the drywall. Coupled with a high performance dehumidifier,
>you should be sitting in butter after that.
>
>-_______________
>Andrei D. Calciu (VA-4270)
>NEC America, Inc.
>14040 Park Center Dr.
>Herndon, VA 20171-3227
>
>Voice: 703-834-4273
>Fax: 703-787-6613
>
>This message and any attachment are confidential. If you are not the
>intended recipient, please telephone or email the sender and delete the
>message and any attachment from your system. If you are not the intended
>recipient you must not copy this message or attachment or disclose the
>contents to any other person.
>
>
>
| Message 13
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: Mick
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:17:07 -0500
Louis N. Scerbo wrote:
> Thanks Andrei,
>
> I've already done everything you suggested
> The blueboard,ligt color and all.
> I would like a little more specific info on how many fish to edible size
> can I expect. How many trays can a 300 gal tank handle. I'd like to grow
> tomatoes, greens, broccoli to start.
>
> Lou
>
> ---
>
Lou,
I've been doing this about a year so I'm no great expert. From a newbie's
perspective, let me say that if this is your first aquaponic project there is a
huge learning curve. So much to learn about providing an environment beneficial
to both plants and fish.
If you are planning on raising tilapia in your 300 gal tank, you might consider
starting with around 100 fish. The ratios of fish to water vary depending on
system but the one we're using is 2 gal per 1 pound of fish. So, if you raise
100 fish to one pound each, you still have a bit to spare.
It's important not to overstock while you learn how a bio-filter works or how to
design a plant tray that will be able to handle the conversion from your fish
tank. Ammonia levels can become toxic very quickly even if you don't
overstock. Overstocking makes any and all problems critical in no time at all.
What we did was set up a bio-filter to clean the fish water and keep the fish
alive while we built the plant tray. As your plant tray's medium matures and
you have some plants establishing root growth in the tray, you gradually phase
out the bio-filter.
Our bio-filter was a 30 gal plastic drum filled with bio-balls and filter
material in front of the intake and outlet openings. The water from the fish
tank was pumped thru this and gravity sent the clean water back to the fish
tank. Cheap to build and no moving parts.
Hope some of this helps
good luck!
Mick
| Message 14
Subject: Re: Water Water everywhere.From: Arlus Farnsworth
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 12:44:07 -0700
And be sure to use food grade or potable materials!
Arlos wrote:
>
> The water (condensate) from an airconditioner (HVAC) is highly acidic and
> generally requires being sent to waste treatment in the electronics
> industry. I wouldn't try and collect it for reuse.
Most common cause of low pH found in condensate water in the range of
4-5
is from dissolved CO (carbon monoxide), CO2 and specific cation (in the
case
of condensate sumps when condensate is recovered). Just make sure your
condensate is not dumping into metal waste piping in the basement,
specifically a cast iron "P" trap of service weight as in time the low
pH
will eat through the trap and clay/ sand soils will leech into the trap
and
plug. PVC and ABS should be used. Best practice would be to build a
small
sump to allow 2 hours or more contact time using calcite, finely crushed
limestone or marble (there are commercial mixes available that are hot
in
trade terms to raise the pH of acidic waters) That would allow the pH to
raise to 7-8 before discharge or recovery. Hope this clarifies the issue
a
bit.
Arlos
| Message 15
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: kris book
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:30:54 -0600
Lou,
I doubt that setting up a system in your basement will save you money in
the long run. When you set up a greenhouse,your major expenditures are up
front but, an indoor operation will cost you month after month. When I
was growing veggies year round at 6,00 ft. elevation, I had to move all
my plants indoors for at least a couple of weeks every January. The
degree of difficulty went up considerably, because when you grow indoors,
you must essentially become Mother Nature. You have to be responsible for
every single thing that plants need to survive.
If you are determined to go on, I suggest you go to your local gro-light
store and get a book for indoor marijuana growing. These guerilla growers
have figured out some incredible techniques that can at least match
production of winter greenhouse growing. Plants grown indoors go south in
a hurry when deficiencies or excesses come into play. You will find that
your basement probably has molds, funguses, and mildews that are almost
unnoticeable because it stays realitvely cool down there but, the heat
from your lights will activate every living thing that is in your
basement. Nothing will kill your plants faster than stale air, so make
sure you have good ventilation. CO2 injection is very important if you
want good fruit set, without it you'll only grow pretty green plants but
not much food.
I hope I haven't discouraged you, because growing food 12 months a year
is very satisfying. I count the 7 years that I grew year round as the
best time of my life but, the first couple of years were full of
failures. Don't get in a hurry and do lots of reading. If you want to
know more about indoor stuff you can write me off list. One last thing, 5
years of success more than made up for the first couple of years.
kris book
On Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:16:14 -0400 "Louis N. Scerbo"
writes:
> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The
> reason I
> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me
> much
> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium,
> as a
> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
> lighting in the winter anyway.
> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530,
> with
> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
> What about the humidity issue?
>
> Thank you all in advance for your help,
> Lou
>
>
| Message 16
Subject: RE: Please Help
From: "Ron Brooks"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 16:55:13 -0400
Lou
it can be done , I had all my breeders in my basement for the longest time.
And to top it off I used soft sided kiddy pools. In the beginning all my
breeders were in a total recirculation system , and I stocked them at 1 per
10 gallons. Now I realize you are looking for figures for a whole nother
kettle of fish so to speak , so if you are looking just to have fresh for
your family and some veggies while learning it is very doable . contact me
off list with all your questions and I will try to answer them .
Oh I think you were asking how many to stock , well it will depend on a lot
of factors , like whether or not you are going to supplement air and such ,
while most will recommend 1/2 pound per gallon . Let me tell you this is not
doable in a basement situation unless you are aerating the water with
outside air , trust me there just is not enough of an air exchange in a
basement environment to support this . My recommendation is 1 pound for
every 4 gallons of water. I stressed out way to many fish and myself trying
to keep the D.O. above 1ppm in the beginning before learning I could not
recycle the basement air into my tanks and NEEDED to bring in a lot of fresh
air . Plus in the beginning It was uncomfortable to be down by the tanks for
any length of time until I started bringing in outside air to refresh the O2
levels down in the basement . Now I understand you plan to grow plants down
there too and they can use the CO2 , but in the beginning it is better to
have to few and grow into the system then to much and get frustrated and
then junk the expense of the system
Ron
-> -----Original Message-----
-> From: aquaponics-request 'at' townsqr.com
-> [mailto:aquaponics-request 'at' townsqr.com]On Behalf Of Louis N. Scerbo
-> Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2001 11:16 PM
-> To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
-> Subject: Please Help
->
->
-> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
-> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
-> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
-> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
-> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
-> lighting in the winter anyway.
-> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
-> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
-> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
-> What about the humidity issue?
->
-> Thank you all in advance for your help,
-> Lou
->
->
| Message 17
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: BMac1978
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 17:36:28 EDT
--part1_d4.bd19d14.28c9465c_boundary
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 9/6/2001 1:24:31 PM Central Daylight Time,
writes:
> I must tell you that was a low shot. I know what you mean. and invite
> anyone to come and check.
> As a new subscriber to the list I hope you all are not like this.
> My question was sincere. I have retired recently and have moved to PA
> where I've purchased 16 acres where I hope to do all the things ie:
> gardening, small scale husbandry, etc.
> If you all don't want to help a guy just starting out just ignore my pot!!!!
>
> Lou
>
Lou,
I am also new, and I have to say that this group is very informative, but
they like to have fun too! Don't take anything like that to heart, if it
bothers you, just assume that it was him that was wishing it he could!!! (ha,
ha) You've got to admit guys, we have some great personalities here!
Everything in the news group can help you, and the rest you've just got to
not worry about it! I too considered my basement, but my computer is down
there and I didn't want to chance messing that up! Fortunately, I have
another option and have decided to set up in our attached garage that is
insulated.
Anyway, I think it was meant as a joke, and if it wasn't, go ahead and take
it as so, no reason to ruin your day over it!
Keep us posted, it sounds like your goals are similar to mine.
Warmly,
Dawn
Michigan
--part1_d4.bd19d14.28c9465c_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
In a message dated 9/6/2001 1:24:31 PM Central Daylight Time,
writes:
I must tell you that was a low shot. I know what you
mean. and invite
anyone to come and check.
As a new subscriber to the list I hope you all are not like this.
My question was sincere. I have retired recently and have moved to PA
where I've purchased 16 acres where I hope to do all the things ie:
gardening, small scale husbandry, etc.
If you all don't want to help a guy just starting out just ignore my pot!!!!
Lou
Lou,
I am also new, and I have to say that this group is very informative, but
they like to have fun too! Don't take anything like that to heart, if it
bothers you, just assume that it was him that was wishing it he could!!! (ha,
ha) You've got to admit guys, we have some great personalities here!
Everything in the news group can help you, and the rest you've just got to
not worry about it! I too considered my basement, but my computer is down
there and I didn't want to chance messing that up! Fortunately, I have
another option and have decided to set up in our attached garage that is
insulated.
Anyway, I think it was meant as a joke, and if it wasn't, go ahead and take
it as so, no reason to ruin your day over it!
Keep us posted, it sounds like your goals are similar to mine.
Warmly,
Dawn
Michigan
--part1_d4.bd19d14.28c9465c_boundary--
| Message 18
Subject: boiler copper
From: "Steven Medlock"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 17:31:48 -0500
Ok I am glad I asked, I guess I have got lucky with the copper coil in the
tank. If I used the coil in the 55 gal. barrel idea wouldn't that also
contaminate my system? Why in 6 months have I had no ill effects with the
copper in the tank? Just hit and miss?
So they do make an exchanger that is able to have the hot water passed
through it and not contaminate the tank? Someone please tell me where
again I can check them out.
Thanks,
Red
| Message 19
Subject: Re: boiler copper
From: Arlus Farnsworth
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 17:45:00 -0700
If you put the copper coil with the steel drum, it will act like a
battery and corrode the "terminals" (coil and drum). Copper ions will be
released gradually even without the battery effect. How long that takes
and whether it reaches a toxic level for your fish depends on various
factors. For instance how much water is in the tank, how much copper is
exposed, total dissolved solids in the water (nitrate reacts with
copper, as someone said), does it get changed out at all.
The food itself might not be balanced well for your requirements.
Steven Medlock wrote:
>
> Ok I am glad I asked, I guess I have got lucky with the copper coil in the
> tank. If I used the coil in the 55 gal. barrel idea wouldn't that also
> contaminate my system? Why in 6 months have I had no ill effects with the
> copper in the tank? Just hit and miss?
| Message 20
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 15:12:41 -1000
hi uall, a grundfos pump (sp?) is a small voltage pump, common at any
plumbing store(wholesale), 1/8 hp or better, very efficient and not
costly
.have seen many used in the solar industry, and small projects.
>From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:41:25 EDT
>
>In a message dated 9/5/01 12:09:51 AM Central Daylight Time,
>aquaponics-digest-request 'at' townsqr.com writes:
>
><< Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
> From: "gerry magnuson"
> Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2001 05:44:39 -1000
>
>
> run copper coils on your roof, install a couple of backflow peventers,
>use a
> grundfos pump, have the water pipes of copper coils submerged in a 55
>gallon
> drum to heat water to be put into the fish tanks
.forget your radiators,
> not even good for making shine
. >>>
>******************************************************************************
>
>****
>
>What is " a grundfos pump,"?
>
>Regards,
>Dave
| Message 21
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 15:20:56 -1000
lou, if you can't handle humor, you are in the wrong business
.most all
products used, can be used for illegal means also, if fact, many of the good
products on the market, are the result of illegal activity
.in your neck of
the woods, I would not be surprised as to how many systems are doing as you
do, just a fact of life
.cowboy
>From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Please Help
>Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:23:05 -0400
>
>Gerry
>
>I must tell you that was a low shot. I know what you mean. and invite
>anyone to come and check.
>As a new subscriber to the list I hope you all are not like this.
>My question was sincere. I have retired recently and have moved to PA
>where I've purchased 16 acres where I hope to do all the things ie:
>gardening, small scale husbandry, etc.
>If you all don't want to help a guy just starting out just ignore my
>pot!!!!
>
>Lou
>
>gerry magnuson wrote:
>
>>do I smell burning weeds?
>>
>>
>>>From: "Louis N. Scerbo"
>>>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>>>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>>>Subject: Please Help
>>>Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 23:16:14 -0400
>>>
>>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>>>want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
>>>more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
>>>first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>>>lighting in the winter anyway.
>>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>>>one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>>> What about the humidity issue?
>>>
>>>Thank you all in advance for your help,
>>>Lou
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
| Message 22
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Thomas Short"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 18:40:16 -0700
=_NextPart_001_0000_01C13703.5F37B340
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok for those of you that are just starting and looking for a place to put=
a small setup. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small=
Greenhouse for around $100 that you can use for the first year or two.
http://www.ns.net~bennu/bkyd/green.html =20
=20
----- Original Message -----
From: Louis N. Scerbo
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:24 AM
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Please Help
=20
>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason =
I
>> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me muc=
h
>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as=
a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn=
.com
=_NextPart_001_0000_01C13703.5F37B340
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ok for those o=
f you that are just starting and looking for a place to put a small setup=
. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small Greenhouse fo=
r around $100 that you can use for the first year or two. &nbs=
p; ----- Original Message ----- From: Louis N. Scerbo Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:=
24 AM To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr=
.com Subject: Re: Please Hel=
p
>> I would like to t=
ry to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>> want=
to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
&g=
t;> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure s=
odium, as a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse=
with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Penns=
ylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anywa=
y.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round ta=
nk, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1=
000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish an=
d PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> =
; What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in=
advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
&g=
t;
&=
gt;
> http://explorer.msn=
.com/intl.asp
>
>
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
=_NextPart_001_0000_01C13703.5F37B340--
| Message 23
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Thomas Short"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 18:53:08 -0700
=_NextPart_001_0001_01C13705.2B69C240
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
OOPS!! I left out a "/" try this
=20
http://www.ns.net/~bennu/bkyd/green.html =20
----- Original Message -----
From: Thomas Short
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:49 PM
To: aquaponics
Subject: Re: Please Help
=20
Ok for those of you that are just starting and looking for a place to put=
a small setup. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small=
Greenhouse for around $100 that you can use for the first year or two.
=20
http://www.ns.net~bennu/bkyd/green.html =20
=20
----- Original Message -----
From: Louis N. Scerbo
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:24 AM
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Please Help
=20
>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason =
I
>> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me muc=
h
>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as=
a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.c=
omGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.ms=
n.com
=_NextPart_001_0001_01C13705.2B69C240
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
OOPS!! I&=
nbsp;left out a "/" try this =
----- Original Message ----- From:=
Thomas Short Sent: Thursday=
, September 06, 2001 6:49 PM To:=
aquaponics Subject: Re:=
Please Help Ok for those of you that are ju=
st starting and looking for a place to put a small setup. Check out this =
web site. It will show you to make a Small Greenhouse for around $100 tha=
t you can use for the first year or two. ----- Origin=
al Message ----- From: Louis N. Scerbo Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:24 AM To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com Subject: Re: Please Help &nbs=
p;
>> I would like to try to set u=
p a system in my basement. The reason I
>> want to do it in my b=
asement is I feel even though it will cost me much
>> more money=
for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
&g=
t;> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd ne=
ed supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>>&nb=
sp; I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-=
6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressur=
e sodium.
>> How many fish and PD-4902 P=
olyTank trays should I use?
>> What about the =
humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in advance for your=
help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
> ______________=
___________________________________________________
> Get your FREE=
download of MSN Explorer at
>
=
>
>
Get more from =
the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
=_NextPart_001_0001_01C13705.2B69C240--
| Message 24
Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 21:04:20 -0500 (CDT)
That's fine gerry just as long as not a drop of fish tank water comes in
contact with copper!. Most of the damage happens only when your systems
biomas is at the upper level of fish load maybe 2 months before your
harvest date after you have signed your delivery contracts and have all
of your processors,supermarkets and shops convinced that they should
give you a chance( your 1 and only chance against their better
judgement)Life is good. And than one day your automatic water changer
goes on the blink or the fish load over loads the system and you needed
2 water changes per week because of a heavier fish load due to the near
harvest weights of your livestock .Your system goes Acidic from the fish
waste, the copper sulphates shoot to the moon,all of the fish die over
night,your standing looking at the dead fish thinking what your going to
tell the banker,processor,market and your wife that's been complaining
about the lack of money and is she going to split town with a used car
sales man all because of a little copper pipping that you thought would
be ok .
Why risk It??
Bruce
| Message 25
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
From: "Thomas Short"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 19:05:47 -0700
=_NextPart_001_0002_01C13706.EFE3CDE0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is the web page:
http://www.us.grundfos.com/web/grundfos.nsf
=20
----- Original Message -----
From: gerry magnuson
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:28 PM
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
=20
hi uall, a grundfos pump (sp?) is a small voltage pump, common at any
plumbing store(wholesale), 1/8 hp or better, very efficient and not
costly
.have seen many used in the solar industry, and small projects.
>From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:41:25 EDT
>
>In a message dated 9/5/01 12:09:51 AM Central Daylight Time,
>
>What is " a grundfos pump,"?
>
>Regards,
>Dave
/intl.as=
pGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn=
.com
=_NextPart_001_0002_01C13706.EFE3CDE0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is the we=
b page: =
----- Original Message ----- From: gerry magnuson=
Sent: Thursday, September 0=
6, 2001 6:28 PM To: aquaponi=
cs 'at' townsqr.com Subject: Re: =
Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01 hi uall, a grundf=
os pump (sp?) is a small voltage pump, common at any
plumbing store(wh=
olesale), 1/8 hp or better, very efficient and not
costly
.have seen =
many used in the solar industry, and small projects
.
>From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com=
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest =
- Tue 09/04/01
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:41:25 EDT
>
>I=
n a message dated 9/5/01 12:09:51 AM Central Daylight Time,
>>What is " a grundfos pump,"?
>
>Regards,
>D=
ave
___=
_______
http://explorer.msn.=
com/intl.asp
Get mo=
re from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
=_NextPart_001_0002_01C13706.EFE3CDE0--
| Message 26
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Chris Jeppesen"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 19:10:23 -0700
Lou
the volume of the grow bed should equal that of the tank. Start low on fish density and work up
went you get to .4 to .5 lbs per gal. start culling or havesting let your water quality be your
guide.
>>>
>>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>>> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
>>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as a
>>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>>> What about the humidity issue?
>>>
>>> Thank you all in advance for your help,
>>> Lou
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
| Message 27
Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:11:53 -1000
hi uall, bruce
.there was a pathology class, and the instructor told the
students to watch everything he did and repeat all exact moves
.he turned
the cadaver over and inserted his middle finger in the anus
.he then with
drew his finger, and inserted the finger next to it in his mouth
.the
students cringed, but all did the same thing
.what they failed to notice is
the use of the different finger in the mouth
as many have commented on what
I have written about copper and cpvc
.I am not using either in my
system
.I gave an alternative for a heat exchange system, no mention of
using the copper in with the fish, conclusions have been made, and all with
good results
.we are back on track with aquaponics
.now, give us your
secrets with your success with tomatoes
.cowboy
>From: (Bruce Schreiber)
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: heat exchangers and collectors
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 21:04:20 -0500 (CDT)
>
>That's fine gerry just as long as not a drop of fish tank water comes in
>contact with copper!. Most of the damage happens only when your systems
>biomas is at the upper level of fish load maybe 2 months before your
>harvest date after you have signed your delivery contracts and have all
>of your processors,supermarkets and shops convinced that they should
>give you a chance( your 1 and only chance against their better
>judgement)Life is good. And than one day your automatic water changer
>goes on the blink or the fish load over loads the system and you needed
>2 water changes per week because of a heavier fish load due to the near
>harvest weights of your livestock .Your system goes Acidic from the fish
>waste, the copper sulphates shoot to the moon,all of the fish die over
>night,your standing looking at the dead fish thinking what your going to
>tell the banker,processor,market and your wife that's been complaining
>about the lack of money and is she going to split town with a used car
>sales man all because of a little copper pipping that you thought would
>be ok .
> Why risk It??
> Bruce
>
| Message 28
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "Thomas Short"
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 19:12:30 -0700
=_NextPart_001_0003_01C13707.DFFD4220
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Try this!
http://www.ns.net/~bennu/bkyd/green.html =20
----- Original Message -----
From: Thomas Short
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:49 PM
To: aquaponics
Subject: Re: Please Help
=20
Ok for those of you that are just starting and looking for a place to put=
a small setup. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small=
Greenhouse for around $100 that you can use for the first year or two.
=20
http://www.ns.net~bennu/bkyd/green.html =20
=20
----- Original Message -----
From: Louis N. Scerbo
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:24 AM
To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
Subject: Re: Please Help
=20
>> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason =
I
>> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me muc=
h
>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as=
a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter anyway.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all in advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.c=
om
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.c=
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=_NextPart_001_0003_01C13707.DFFD4220
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Try this=
! ----- Original Message=
----- From: Thomas Short Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:49 PM To: aquaponics =
Subject: Re: Please Help Ok for those=
of you that are just starting and looking for a place to put a small set=
up. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small Greenhouse =
for around $100 that you can use for the first year or two. &n=
bsp; ----- Original Message ----- From: Louis N. Scerbo Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 1=
1:24 AM To: aquaponics 'at' towns=
qr.com Subject: Re: Please H=
elp
>> I would like to=
try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
>> wa=
nt to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
=
>> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure=
sodium, as a
>> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhou=
se with heating.
>> I live in Northeastern Pen=
nsylvania so I'd need supplemental
>> lighting in the winter any=
way.
>> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round =
tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
>> one each 1000W metal halide and=
1000W high pressure sodium.
>> How many fish =
and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
>> &nb=
sp; What about the humidity issue?
>>
>> Thank you all =
in advance for your help,
>> Lou
>>
>
>
=
> >
> http://explorer.m=
sn.com/intl.asp
>
>
=
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
=
Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :=
=
Get more from the Web.=
FREE MSN Explorer download : http:/=
/explorer.msn.com
=_NextPart_001_0003_01C13707.DFFD4220--
| Message 29
Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:17:04 -1000
excellent, thank you
.cowboy
>From: "Thomas Short"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: "aquaponics"
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 19:05:47 -0700
>
>This is the web page:
>http://www.us.grundfos.com/web/grundfos.nsf
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: gerry magnuson
>Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:28 PM
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
>
>hi uall, a grundfos pump (sp?) is a small voltage pump, common at any
>plumbing store(wholesale), 1/8 hp or better, very efficient and not
>costly
.have seen many used in the solar industry, and small projects.>
>
>
>
>
> >From: DAVEINBHAM 'at' aol.com
> >Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
> >To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
> >Subject: Re: Aquaponics Digest - Tue 09/04/01
> >Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 14:41:25 EDT
> >
> >In a message dated 9/5/01 12:09:51 AM Central Daylight Time,
>
> >
> >What is " a grundfos pump,"?
> >
> >Regards,
> >Dave
>
>
>
>
>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer
>download :
| Message 30
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: "gerry magnuson"
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 16:20:09 -1000
or
.www.hydroponicstore.com.
>From: "Thomas Short"
>Reply-To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>To: "aquaponics"
>Subject: Re: Please Help
>Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 19:12:30 -0700
>
> Try this!
> http://www.ns.net/~bennu/bkyd/green.html
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Thomas Short
>Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 6:49 PM
>To: aquaponics
>Subject: Re: Please Help
>
>Ok for those of you that are just starting and looking for a place to put a
>small setup. Check out this web site. It will show you to make a Small
>Greenhouse for around $100 that you can use for the first year or two.
>
>http://www.ns.net~bennu/bkyd/green.html
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Louis N. Scerbo
>Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 11:24 AM
>To: aquaponics 'at' townsqr.com
>Subject: Re: Please Help
>
>
> >> I would like to try to set up a system in my basement. The reason I
> >> want to do it in my basement is I feel even though it will cost me much
> >> more money for Lighting ie: metal halide and high pressure sodium, as
>a
> >> first system it will be cheaper than a greenhouse with heating.
> >> I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania so I'd need supplemental
> >> lighting in the winter anyway.
> >> I plan a system with a 300 gal. round tank, PolyTank, PT-6530, with
> >> one each 1000W metal halide and 1000W high pressure sodium.
> >> How many fish and PD-4902 PolyTank trays should I use?
> >> What about the humidity issue?
> >>
> >> Thank you all in advance for your help,
> >> Lou
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
>
>
>
>
>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
>Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download :
>
| Message 31
Subject: Re: Please Help
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2001 21:28:24 -0500 (CDT)
Lou after a long day I have to get some sleep to be up by 3:30am for
another 19hr. day tomorrow if you can wait a few days I will help you if
some one else has not yet ok
Bruce
|
