Aquaponics Digest - Sun 10/14/01
Message 1: RE: (no subject) greetings Jim
from "Mark Allen Wells"
Message 2: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 3: Re:
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 4: Re: Niche markets
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 5: Re: Aquaponics list dynamics
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 6: Re: Niche markets
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 7: Adrianna ref tomatos
from "STEVE SPRING"
Message 8: Re: Fw: grilling versus frying
from David Inselman
Message 9: Re: Adrianna ref tomatos
from "bennett"
Message 10: swordfish, yum
from Jenny Reed
Message 11: Re: swordfish, yum
from Brian Gracia
Message 12: Re: swordfish, yum
from Mick
Message 13: Re: swordfish, yum
from "Robert Rogers"
Message 14: Re: swordfish, yum
from "Robert Rogers"
Message 15: Re: swordfish,
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 16: Re: Niche markets
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 17: Re: (no subject)
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 18: RE: Adrianna ref tomatos
from "Chris Jeppesen"
Message 19: Re: Niche markets
from "Gene Batten"
Message 20: Re: Bed Media - Lava Rock
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 21: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 22: Re: (no subject) greetings Jim
from conrad wilkins
Message 23: Re: Niche markets
from Mick
Message 24: Re: Niche markets
from conrad wilkins
Message 25: Re: (no subject)
from UPJames@aol.com
Message 26: Re: (no subject) greetings Jim
from UPJames@aol.com
Message 27: Re: (no subject)
from UPJames@aol.com
Message 28: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
from pablo obiaga
Message 29: Re: Rucula (Italian)
from pablo obiaga
Message 30: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds
from pablo obiaga
Message 31: Re: Bed Media - Lava Rock
from "NiCKEL"
Message 32: happy note
from "Steven Medlock"
Message 33: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria on Mars
from "TGTX"
Message 34: UP perch
from "Pete and Diana Scholtens"
Message 35: Re: Adriana ref tomatos
from "gutierrez-lagatta"
Message 36: Re: (no subject)
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 37: RE: (no subject)
from "Mark Allen Wells"
Message 38: Re: Fw: grilling versus frying
from "Robert Rogers"
Message 39: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria
on Mars
from (Bruce Schreiber)
Message 40: Re: Niche markets
from "Gene Batten"
Message 41: RE: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria on Mars
from "Mark Allen Wells"
Message 42: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria
on Mars
from "Chris Jeppesen"
Message 43: Re: Home Power Magazine - Thermo-Electric-Generator (TEG)
from Carolyn Hoagland
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| Message 1 |
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Subject: RE: (no subject) greetings Jim
From: "Mark Allen Wells"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:11:15 -0500
Hello Jim,
welcome to the aquaponics list. I always enjoy meeting people interested in
other species. (nothing against tilapia..great fish...I just think diversity
is good. Hybrid bluegill are very easy for me to get so I started there.)
I'm in Indiana and would love to see the upper Peninsula someday. When you
say "screen filter" are you talking about a drum screen? I've seen stuff
here on sump and vortex filters but not much on screen filters. It seems to
me that under heavy loading they would require a lot of maintenance but I
may be wrong. I'll play around in the search engines and see what I can dig
up (if you don't get help from the great people here). Does your round tank
have a cone shaped bottom? This was a decent page describing an 800 gal
system. I thought his filter ideas may give you some food for thought.
http://www.carr.lib.md.us/schs/science/aquaculture/800.html
best wishes...
mark
---
If anyone knows how to build or design and uses a screen filter for removing
solids I would appreciate any suggestions pro or con. I want to raise Yellow
Perch and if anyone has any experience with this species in an aquaponics
system I would like to find out if you were successful or not.
I live in the beautiful Upper Peninsula of Michigan
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| Message 2 |
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Subject: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:16:48 -0500
Pablo,
I might add that I have dropped the temp to 60F frequently during major
water changes and all did fine. (But, I was right there to make sure that my
in-tank heater was performing properly. This low temp was only for a few
minutes until the heater started raising the temp.) This particular time, it
was a major fiasco, the water temp was 60F for a couple of days not to
mention NO CIRCULATION, THEREFORE NO AERATION..(Electrical problem.) The
Pacu, most of them, did fine. I lost about the same number of Pacu that I
did Tilapia.
So far, I just love the Pacu which is more than I can say for the Tilapia.
I just love watching these little buggars eat. You can surely tell that they
are members of the Pirannah (sp) family. They just swarm the food. Looks
like something on the Discovery Channel. I always look forward to feeding
them. I even have a blender set up in the "farm" so I can make apple food
for them in addition to their usual flake diet. (No, I haven't completely
lost my mind. The Pacu are vegetarians and I'm trying to switch their diet
to fruit instead of commercial flakes.)
Just thought I would throw this in.
Later.......Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Schreiber"
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
Pablo I talked to Steve yesterday and he told me the water temp dropped
to
60 degrees Fahrenheit
and the pacu did fine
Bruce
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| Message 3 |
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Subject: Re:
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:28:24 -0500
Hi Freddy,
Again, I don't know if I should address this to Freddy or Dan or Sarah King.
BUT, PLS. UNDERSTAND THAT I AM NOT THE ONE WHO RUNS THIS LIST!! Paula has
to be squirming about that.
This list is run by a wonderful lady by the name of Paula Spereanno (sp)
(Sorry Paula, I could never get that spelling right.)
I'm just one of the ones on the list who is "a little" vocal...much to my
demise sometime.
(And I really don't want to get into the previous problem...It seems to have
died and I would like to keep it that way.)
Take care.....LOL.......Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dan and Sarah King"
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 6:33 AM
I am new to the list, could you please explain the problem between
Steve(the guy that runs the list? I'm terrible with names!!)and this other
guy? thanks Freddy
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| Message 4 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:33:08 -0500
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Jeppesen"
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 7:18 AM
Subject: Re: Niche markets
Conrad
Yes They are Gouramis.> Chris, I ate these in Indonsia and I didn't like
them. Way too bony, but the locals loved them.< I have heard they are good
to eat and grow to about 11 inches long.>Yes, they get big, but so do carp<
Just my thoughts......Steve
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| Message 5 |
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Subject: Re: Aquaponics list dynamics
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:38:21 -0500
Hi Paula,
I didn't think it would take you long to jump on that. (Well, after a long
night at the hospital, I needed that laugh...GOD luv ya.)
No Freddy, I'm in no way affable to open old wounds that apparently have
healed.
I love this lovely list the way it is. (Concentrating on Aquaponics!!)
Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "S & S Aqua Farm"
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 7:21 AM
Subject: Aquaponics list dynamics
At 06:33 AM 10/12/2001 -0500, you wrote:
>I am new to the list, could you please explain the problem between
>Steve(the guy that runs the list? I'm terrible with names!!)and this other
>guy? thanks Freddy
Freddy - the "problem" has hopefully been taken off list, and is not germain
to our primary discussion area. I'm sure if you feel it's important that it
can be explained to you...again off-list.
Normal list dynamics are generally more cooperative than they have been of
late, but I think we're returning to that level.
As for Steve "running" the list -- he only appears that way sometimes :>)
Since he gets the mail in digest form, I have all day before he comes back
to me on that!
Paula Speraneo
S&S Aqua Farm, 8386 County Road 8820, West Plains, MO 65775 417-256-5124
Web page http://www.townsqr.com/snsaqua/
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| Message 6 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 00:45:40 -0500
Chris,
You don't grow this stuff from seed. You grow it from cuttings. There are no
seeds.
I'll do something that I don't usually do...but, it was done once for me and
I do believe in reciprococity (sp) Send me your address and I will send you
some cuttings. Send it to: careplus22 if you don't want your
address spread all over the internet. (I mean, since I am the one who RUNS
THIS LIST.....I'm still laughing about that..........NOT AT YOU FREDDY....It
was just funny and I could just see Paula...WHAT???!!!)
Later my friend........Steve
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Jeppesen"
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: Niche markets
STEVE
Just trying to learn all I can about this. I can't (so far) find seed. The
lady at the oriental store is going to call when she has some but I'm not
shure if I can tell the difference either. I guess if I put it in my aquatic
bed and I grows then It is the aquatic type>
Chris Jeppesen
>Geez Chris,
>
>I don't know. I think the aquatic type. I know that there were 2 types
when
>I bought mine. One was $2/lb and the other was $2.99/lb. I told the
merchant
>that I wanted the type that grows in the water. It was the $2.99/lb.
>
>Don't know if this helps.
>
>Steve
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Chris Jeppesen"
>
>Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 9:24 PM
>Subject: Re: Niche markets
>
>
>STEVE
>Which type kang kong are you growing? The kind that grows in wet ground or
>the aquatic type that grows in shallow water.
>I have been playing with one bed that has about 3 inches of water over
about
>3 inches of pea gravel. It grows really nice water cress. and the pink
>Kissers and gold fish init seem to to better than in the big tank.
>Chris Jeppesen
>
>> "STEVE SPRING" Re: Niche
>marketsDate: Thu, 11 Oct 2001 20:11:01 -0500
>>Reply-To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
>>
>>Hi Mark,
>
>>I'm still doing my Pacu though and my Kang Kong.......just intrigued by
>this
>>combination. The Pacu are growing just fine and the Kang Kong...WELL, YOU
>>JUST WOULDN'T BELIEVE IT!
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------
>http://Game.37.com/ <--- Free Games
>http://newJoke.com/ <--- J O K E S ! ! !
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Subject: Adrianna ref tomatos
From: "STEVE SPRING"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 01:06:09 -0500
Hi Adrianna,
I've been meaning to ask you this. I know that you do mostly hydroponics.
I, as you know, grow my tomatos in Earth Boxes. The tomatos are in the
greenhouse. (I'm prepared now to try my "Summertime Tomatos in the Winter".)
But, my question is this: 90% of my tomatos are picture perfect. But some
otherwise perfect tomatos develop a ...(it is hard to describe)...hard...to
use the word "cancerous looking" growth on the bottom. The rest of the
tomato is fine, but the "growth" part is ...(looking for a
word)...."unappealing" and makes the tomato unsellable.
If you or anyone else has any input, I would TRULY appreciate it.
Thanks......Steve
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Subject: Re: Fw: grilling versus frying
From: David Inselman
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 07:00:49 -0500
>
> > Perhaps you could grill that fish, much better for your
> cardiovascular system.
> I was born in Hutchinson KS.
> Bob
Bob,
Grilling works too.
I went to an AMBUC convention in Hutch several years ago and found it to be
a neat little town.
Your welcome to come by for some grilled fish too.
Dave
Ponca City, OK
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| Message 9 |
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Subject: Re: Adrianna ref tomatos
From: "bennett"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 07:59:38 -0400
>use the word "cancerous looking" growth on the bottom. The rest of the
>tomato is fine, but the "growth" part is ...(looking for a
>word)...."unappealing" and makes the tomato unsellable.
>
Is it black?
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| Message 10 |
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Subject: swordfish, yum
From: Jenny Reed
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 08:48:29 -0400 (EDT)
Hey everyone. I had swordfish at a restaurant last night. First time I'd
ever had swordfish. I have to say, without a doubt, it was the BEST fish
I'd ever eaten.... I was so tempted to order several more orders to take
home for later :)
Okay, I admit it's possible that the chef just might have had something to
do with the taste.
Even so, the thing that kept me from sleeping well last night (heh... okay,
actually that was my hyper dog, who has recently decided that cats must be
barked at) was lying awake wondering about raising swordfish.
I don't even know what a real swordfish looks like. I have a vague image
of a cartoon fish with a sharp nose that can use it to duel with cartoon
characters holding metal swords. This nose is probably serrated so it can
double to saw through wood, too.
So that said, can anyone tell me anything about swordfish? Size of fish,
fresh or salt water, whether anyone has successfully grown them before,
etc? Any URLs you can point me to? Any advice? ("Forget it, it'll never
work" may not be what I want to hear this morning, but it's definitely
useful advice if you have reasons for saying it.)
Thanks, everyone :)
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Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
From: Brian Gracia
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 08:27:47 -0500
Sword Fish is a deep water fish found in the oceans. I strongly doubt it
will work. They get pretty big.
Brian
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Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
From: Mick
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 08:34:38 -0500
Jenny Reed wrote:
>
> Hey everyone. I had swordfish at a restaurant last night. First time I'd
> ever had swordfish.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jenny,
Did you see the movie "The Perfect Storm"? If memory serves, they were
fishing for swordfish. Definitely salt water and LARGE fish.
Mick
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Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
From: "Robert Rogers"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 10:09:08 -0400
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mick"
Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2001 9:34 AM
Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
> Jenny Reed wrote:
> >
> > Hey everyone. I had swordfish at a restaurant last night. First time
I'd
> > ever had swordfish.
>
I don't think swordfish will work,
Some people seem to be having luck raising paddle fish,
(Polydon spathula). Some fine restaurants are serving it. We used to catch
them in the river, you have to snag them ,they feed by filtering nutrients
out of the water. There is a fair amount of info on the internet about them.
Bob
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Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
From: "Robert Rogers"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 10:16:11 -0400
Think that spelling is polyodon.
Anyone know how to get spellcheck in outlook express?
Paddle fish eggs are also used for caviar.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Rogers"
Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2001 10:09 AM
Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mick"
>
> Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2001 9:34 AM
> Subject: Re: swordfish, yum
>
>
> > Jenny Reed wrote:
> > >
> > > Hey everyone. I had swordfish at a restaurant last night. First time
> I'd
> > > ever had swordfish.
> >
> I don't think swordfish will work,
> Some people seem to be having luck raising paddle fish,
> (Polydon spathula). Some fine restaurants are serving it. We used to catch
> them in the river, you have to snag them ,they feed by filtering nutrients
> out of the water. There is a fair amount of info on the internet about
them.
> Bob
>
>
>
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Subject: Re: swordfish,
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 10:27:03 -0500 (CDT)
Jenny sword fish is a deep water ocean fish that even I would not try to
raise I have learned my limits they rub fins with tuna and big sharks
.If you rent the movie the perfect storm that I mentioned a few days ago
you will see their size and how they are caught and get a realistic
respect for the fisherman that Longline for them and then try the book
(old man and the sea)
Bruce
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 10:57:27 -0500 (CDT)
Gene I have the experience and the contacts at the retail and wholesale
levels now is the best time I have ever seen to start a side line in
tropicals especially since over sea air freight have become uncertain .I
was told that some bug was at work in the Florida fish farms but they
did not specify as to which one. Raise what do good in your water with
out adjustments as to PH and you will have few problems.Join your local
Aquarium club so you can have a few guys like me on hand locally to walk
you through the steps and to stop you from making costly mistakes.You
can do it Aquaponicaly
Bruce
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| Message 17 |
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Subject: Re: (no subject)
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 11:17:17 -0500 (CDT)
Jim its good to have you on the list and your expertise with fish
hatcherys will be a benefit to us all.Arlos I am sure has the
information that you seek and he will be back on the list soon He works
at the San fransisco Aquarium. Mark do you have his E-mail address handy
for Jim?
Jim I live right next to a Salmon stream it was in my basement again
last night!
Clean up time again.
How hard is it to hatch and raise them at home?
Bruce
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Subject: RE: Adrianna ref tomatos
From: "Chris Jeppesen"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 09:28:16 -0700
Steve are you talking about bottom end rot. If so it is caused by the the lack of calcium.
Chris Jeppesen
> "STEVE SPRING" Adrianna ref tomatosDate: Sun,
14 Oct 2001 01:06:09 -0500
>Reply-To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
>
>Hi Adrianna,
>
>I've been meaning to ask you this. I know that you do mostly hydroponics.
>
>I, as you know, grow my tomatos in Earth Boxes. The tomatos are in the
>greenhouse. (I'm prepared now to try my "Summertime Tomatos in the Winter".)
>
>But, my question is this: 90% of my tomatos are picture perfect. But some
>otherwise perfect tomatos develop a ...(it is hard to describe)...hard...to
>use the word "cancerous looking" growth on the bottom. The rest of the
>tomato is fine, but the "growth" part is ...(looking for a
>word)...."unappealing" and makes the tomato unsellable.
>
>If you or anyone else has any input, I would TRULY appreciate it.
>
>Thanks......Steve
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| Message 19 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: "Gene Batten"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 12:32:03 -0400
Bruce,
Thanks for the response. This is something to think about. Since I live in
North Carolina about 2-3 hours drive from the coast, any fish that I raise
must be in tanks.
I am presently "between jobs" having been "downsized" from Nortel Networks.
So, I am always on the outlook for potential home based businesses. I have
no experience with tropical fish, and know very little about them. My first
reaction is that if it is such a great opportunity, why aren't others doing
it? Maybe they are? Any examples?
Many "opportunities" do not turn out to be as great as they first appear.
This may be different. I am just trying to be realistic without missing an
opportunity if it really exists.
Thanks to you, and anyone else, for sharing any additional info or advise.
...Gene Batten
=========================
> Gene I have the experience and the contacts at the retail and wholesale
> levels now is the best time I have ever seen to start a side line in
> tropicals especially since over sea air freight have become uncertain .I
> was told that some bug was at work in the Florida fish farms but they
> did not specify as to which one. Raise what do good in your water with
> out adjustments as to PH and you will have few problems.Join your local
> Aquarium club so you can have a few guys like me on hand locally to walk
> you through the steps and to stop you from making costly mistakes.You
> can do it Aquaponicaly
> Bruce
>
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Subject: Re: Bed Media - Lava Rock
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 11:31:38 -0500 (CDT)
You need to test it to see if it leaches a no no .but this mostly
applies to salt water where Fluoride can be a problem .To test use a
canary fish in a container that contains the lava and don't forget the
water ,if it dies try again if the next one dies and you fed it normally
the substrates lava is suspect
Bruce
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| Message 21 |
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Subject: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 11:41:09 -0500 (CDT)
Bill I use them to .WASH THEM OUT REAL GOOD and get the ones that held
food stuffs Pickles etc if possible.Pass on the ones that held say
Parequat because they still leach for some time sort of defeating your
purpose
Bruce
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Subject: Re: (no subject) greetings Jim
From: conrad wilkins
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 09:57:53 -0500
Just curiouse to find out why youd want to filter the water going to the plant
beds. Arnt those solids what feed the bacteria that in turn feed the plants. So
wouldnt you be throwing away a valuable resource......Mind you I am thinking
about the S&S system and not any of the other possibles..
Conrad.
Mark Allen Wells wrote:
> Hello Jim,
>
> welcome to the aquaponics list. I always enjoy meeting people interested in
> other species. (nothing against tilapia..great fish...I just think diversity
> is good. Hybrid bluegill are very easy for me to get so I started there.)
> I'm in Indiana and would love to see the upper Peninsula someday. When you
> say "screen filter" are you talking about a drum screen? I've seen stuff
> here on sump and vortex filters but not much on screen filters. It seems to
> me that under heavy loading they would require a lot of maintenance but I
> may be wrong. I'll play around in the search engines and see what I can dig
> up (if you don't get help from the great people here). Does your round tank
> have a cone shaped bottom? This was a decent page describing an 800 gal
> system. I thought his filter ideas may give you some food for thought.
> http://www.carr.lib.md.us/schs/science/aquaculture/800.html
>
> best wishes...
> mark
> ---
>
> If anyone knows how to build or design and uses a screen filter for removing
> solids I would appreciate any suggestions pro or con. I want to raise Yellow
> Perch and if anyone has any experience with this species in an aquaponics
> system I would like to find out if you were successful or not.
> I live in the beautiful Upper Peninsula of Michigan
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| Message 23 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: Mick
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 12:06:34 -0500
Gene,
I was interested in raising ornamental fish for additional profit. The
local pet stores are selling a type of tilapia. The fish is small and
shiny black with beautiful irridescent purple markings. I don't
remember the complete scientific name of the fish but the word tilapia
was part of its designation.
They are selling this fish for quite a bit more than the other
tropicals. I thought I'd buy a breeding pair and give it a try. If
they are as easy to raise as the tilapia I have, then the profit
potential is much greater because you don't have the time factor the
larger tilapia have in gaining market size.
I called Parks and Wildlife before I bought the fish. They said the
fish is considered exotic and since my permits are for delivering live
fish to food markets, it would be illegal for me to raise and sell them
to pet stores.
The other ornamental tropical fish that are easy to breed don't command
the same selling price. I'm not saying don't do it... just maybe do
some serious math and research before you decide to get into it.
Mick
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| Message 24 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: conrad wilkins
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 10:31:10 -0500
Just some thoughts. Are your permits expensive and would it be possible to
get two. One for suplying the food market and one for suplying the aquarium
market. Are the tilapia that you raise for food atractive enough to sell to
the aquarium trade. Youd probably get a better price there for the same
size fish than at the fish mongers.
Conrad.
Mick wrote:
> Gene,
>
> I was interested in raising ornamental fish for additional profit. The
> local pet stores are selling a type of tilapia. The fish is small and
> shiny black with beautiful irridescent purple markings. I don't
> remember the complete scientific name of the fish but the word tilapia
> was part of its designation.
>
> They are selling this fish for quite a bit more than the other
> tropicals. I thought I'd buy a breeding pair and give it a try. If
> they are as easy to raise as the tilapia I have, then the profit
> potential is much greater because you don't have the time factor the
> larger tilapia have in gaining market size.
>
> I called Parks and Wildlife before I bought the fish. They said the
> fish is considered exotic and since my permits are for delivering live
> fish to food markets, it would be illegal for me to raise and sell them
> to pet stores.
>
> The other ornamental tropical fish that are easy to breed don't command
> the same selling price. I'm not saying don't do it... just maybe do
> some serious math and research before you decide to get into it.
>
> Mick
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| Message 25 |
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Subject: Re: (no subject)
From: UPJames@aol.com
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 14:53:24 EDT
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Hi
Thanks for the info. Do you know the address?
Jim
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Hi
Thanks for the info. Do you know the address?
Jim
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| Message 26 |
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Subject: Re: (no subject) greetings Jim
From: UPJames@aol.com
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 15:19:00 EDT
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Hi
Thanks for the info. Yes, my tank will have a round cone shaped bottom. The
screen I was referring to is a rectangular tank with several screens in a row
that have some type of filter material attached that allows water to pass,
but trap solids. They are cleaned once a day by spraying water on them and
collecting the waste water to use on my outside garden. They are bio-filters,
but mainly remove solids not ammonia which is converted by the growing beds.
The fish rearing part of the system I am going to build will have 4 water
exchanges an hour and I will only be using some of the water in the growing
beds. This system is a similar one that was designed at the Fresh Water
Institute.
Thanks for the info.
Jim
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Hi
Thanks for the info. Yes, my tank will have a round cone shaped bottom. The screen I was
referring to is a rectangular tank with several screens in a row that have some type of filter
material attached that allows water to pass, but trap solids. They are cleaned once a day by
spraying water on them and collecting the waste water to use on my outside garden. They are
bio-filters, but mainly remove solids not ammonia which is converted by the growing beds. The
fish rearing part of the system I am going to build will have 4 water exchanges an hour and I
will only be using some of the water in the growing beds. This system is a similar one that was
designed at the Fresh Water Institute.
Thanks for the info.
Jim
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| Message 27 |
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Subject: Re: (no subject)
From: UPJames@aol.com
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 15:29:13 EDT
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Hi
I am much more knowledgeable about Trout(Brook Trout, Brown Trout and Lake
Trout) then Salmon. I do know that they both require much colder water temps
then will work in an Aquaponics system. The warmer water creates a lot stress
which leads to disease problems with cold water species. Because of the
colder temps their growth is much slower then warm water species so it takes
longer to grow to a market size. Their are quite a few private fish
hatcheries that raise trout for stocking in private ponds and streams.
Jim
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Hi
I am much more knowledgeable about Trout(Brook Trout, Brown Trout and Lake Trout) then
Salmon. I do know that they both require much colder water temps then will work in an
Aquaponics system. The warmer water creates a lot stress which leads to disease problems with
cold water species. Because of the colder temps their growth is much slower then warm water
species so it takes longer to grow to a market size. Their are quite a few private fish
hatcheries that raise trout for stocking in private ponds and streams.
Jim
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| Message 28 |
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Subject: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
From: pablo obiaga
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 16:50:13 -0300
STEVE:
.........................
you wrote:
(No, I haven't completely
>lost my mind. The Pacu are vegetarians and I'm trying to switch their diet
>to fruit instead of commercial flakes.)
......................
Not at all. They are fruit eaters in their natural environment. Its good
you feed them anithing you don't have to buy. In the northern part of the
country, in summer, I've been told they can be seen voraciouslly eating
almost anythig that falls from the docks or the ships, especially grain
cargos. They would eat wheat, maize, soy beans etc. If you have fruit trees
or leftovers you save some bucks. Remember they eat fruit that falls from
trees so they eat fruit that has time passed for human. Perhaps you can get
some from town vegetable markets, and producers' markets. They usually have
lots of waists.
On time I'll get to them. I bett in 1 or 2 years I'll be selling them as
delicatessen.
I guess nowledge and money decides. I'll be getting the Bagres I commented
for 18 dollars/ thousand. I can't refuse to start with such a price. Its
cheaper to do my learning killing with these. I'll only have food, nitrogen
and oxygen to worry about.
Feed us with your progress and get a cat for such accidents man. Kitten
will love you. :)
I'll get one my self. Just in case.
Be well,
Pablo
At 00:16 14/10/01 -0500, you wrote:
>Pablo,
>
>I might add that I have dropped the temp to 60F frequently during major
>water changes and all did fine. (But, I was right there to make sure that my
>in-tank heater was performing properly. This low temp was only for a few
>minutes until the heater started raising the temp.) This particular time, it
>was a major fiasco, the water temp was 60F for a couple of days not to
>mention NO CIRCULATION, THEREFORE NO AERATION..(Electrical problem.) The
>Pacu, most of them, did fine. I lost about the same number of Pacu that I
>did Tilapia.
>
>So far, I just love the Pacu which is more than I can say for the Tilapia.
>I just love watching these little buggars eat. You can surely tell that they
>are members of the Pirannah (sp) family. They just swarm the food. Looks
>like something on the Discovery Channel. I always look forward to feeding
>them. I even have a blender set up in the "farm" so I can make apple food
>for them in addition to their usual flake diet. (No, I haven't completely
>lost my mind. The Pacu are vegetarians and I'm trying to switch their diet
>to fruit instead of commercial flakes.)
>
>Just thought I would throw this in.
>
>Later.......Steve
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Bruce Schreiber"
>
>Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2001 3:01 PM
>Subject: Re: Pacu and blow hard problem
>
>
>Pablo I talked to Steve yesterday and he told me the water temp dropped
>to
> 60 degrees Fahrenheit
>and the pacu did fine
> Bruce
>
>
>
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| Message 29 |
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Subject: Re: Rucula (Italian)
From: pablo obiaga
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:09:57 -0300
Thanks Chris, I'll try that too. Its the traditional way. I guess after a
good wash they will not contaminate the beds. I saw Basil directly on sand
beds (dripping hydro) outdoor they take 2 weeks but is less labor and space
cost.
At 18:21 13/10/01 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Pablo
>When I start chives I put the soil in a flat about 1 1/2 inches deep then
when the seed is sewn and covered with soil I soak it all with fish water.
I then put the flat in another box about 3 1/2 inches deep and cover it
with glass that is 50% shaded with lime. On hot days i turn the glass so
that ihave some vent space in the corners but i cover it tight at night.
Usually they are ready to transplant before I need to water it more. When i
do basil this way I plant on monday and transplant the next saturday.
Chives are a lot slower.
>Chris Jeppesen
>
>>Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 21:19:43 -0300
>> aquaponics@townsqr.com pablo obiaga Re: Rucula
(Italian)Reply-To: aquaponics@townsqr.com
>>
>>At 13:34 13/10/01 -0500, you wrote:
>>>Pablo,
>>>This is also known as arugula and it grows awesome in hydro. However,
>>>it grows best in cooler temperatures. When it gets up above 85
>>>degrees F it is not very happy.
>>
>>So I guess I've found what I need as a winter crop. Rucula is delicious
>>whith pear slices as thin as chips and thick parmiggiano grinds.
>>
>>>
>>>As to ciboullete - I think this is chives or "cebollina".
>>
>>Our "cebollina" is usually onion plantlets that don't make it to the field
>>and are sold that way. Ciboullete is milder and ment to be consumed that
>>way. Its onion is tiny. We call it as the french to differentiate it form
>>our's. Freshcut is sold in supermarkets 5dollar a pound. I recall now a
>>British lady calling it chives so probably we are talking the same plant.
>>I'll take your advice.
>>
>>Thanks Adriana,
>> Pablo
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------
>http://Game.37.com/ <--- Free Games
>http://newJoke.com/ <--- J O K E S ! ! !
>
>
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| Message 30 |
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Subject: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds
From: pablo obiaga
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:32:34 -0300
Bill,
You have to be very sure that what it contained before isn't harmful for
plants, human or fish. Wash them a lot ..., many lots. I used some vanilla
escence blue barrels in hydroponics. 3 monthes later I still hated cookies.
I cut them the way you said and sowed the 2 halfs together by the cut edge
with sweet wire so they would keep stable on the floor and wouldn't not
roll over. That way no futher base was needed.
Deppending of the size of your instalation in acuaponics it may increase
your piping costs. But, zero bucks is a wonderfull start.
Pablo
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| Message 31 |
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Subject: Re: Bed Media - Lava Rock
From: "NiCKEL"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 13:46:25 -0700
Excellent idea,
That's one of those infamous why didn't I think of that ideas ;).
Thanks
-Geoff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Schreiber"
Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2001 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: Bed Media - Lava Rock
> You need to test it to see if it leaches a no no .but this mostly
> applies to salt water where Fluoride can be a problem .To test use a
> canary fish in a container that contains the lava and don't forget the
> water ,if it dies try again if the next one dies and you fed it normally
> the substrates lava is suspect
>
> Bruce
>
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| Message 32 |
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Subject: happy note
From: "Steven Medlock"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:20:07 -0500
Who ever made the comment on using a leaf blower on Tomatoes for pollination
was dead on. I have been fighting with this for months. Now I have fruit
setting all over, I was about to give up on them my patients were all used
up. So thanks for the tip.
Steve(red)
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| Message 33 |
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Subject: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria on Mars
From: "TGTX"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:58:02 -0500
> Hey, anybody have any thoughts on using blue poly barrels cut in halves
> (long ways) or shallower for grow beds? I just got four for free and
> can probably get as many as I want.
>Anybody have experience using them for
> beds (can't believe I'd be the first one)? Can't beat the price!
> Bill
> "Brakes? Who needs 'em? When in doubt - ACCELERATE!"
Howdy, Mr. Bill.
Sounds like a plan if you can get this "unlimited" supply of barrels that
you referred to.
I think Jim. has done the same thing, him being the Great
Improvisor and Innovator that he is.
It might involve some plumbing as you say, but not all that much, me thinks.
I have a few of these plastic barrels myself, but I might use these for
watergarden pond filters.
Sure is good to here from you, Mr. Patrick. How goes it in Florida?
Mikey Dread, are you out there? How did the Carribean storm treat you? You
O.K.?
O.K. here is something interesting, and I challenge y'all to investigate it
and ponder it.
A recent NASA report presents a proposal to harness photosynthetic bacteria
to generate essential materials needed during human and robotic exploration
on the surface of Mars. Using a small amount of water and some CO2, N2, and
other elements already present in the Martian environment, with sunlight as
the source of energy, the bacteria would produce O2 and fix carbon and use
the nitrogen, etc. Check out the article
"A Biologically Evolved and Genetically Engineered Bacteria for Facilitating
Oxygen Delivery Throughout the Mars Advanced Outpost".....by going to
http://www.nasatech.com, click on the Technical Support Package link and
then go to the Bio-Medical page. You have to register to access this
information, by the way.
This article came to my attention via Nasa Tech Briefs magazine, which I
subscribe to.
Some folks are bummed about the future, and freedom, and space exploration,
and that kinda neat stuff now that the 14th century loser-bandits in the
Afghan bunkers have declared war on the rest of the world (with the possible
aid and abetting of other scarlet henchmen and puppeteers). But, hey, just
because genocide is running amok on this Old Earth, amid the opportunistic
machinations and maneuvers of the regressive agitators that arrogantly and
deceptively call themselves progressive.......doesn't mean we curl up and
give up the ghost, IMHO. Time to girdle up the old Huevos Rancheros and
take care of some bidnez........That's my plan, how about you?
No, instead of fetal curling, we should resist the aggression, deception,
and oppression.....we're all gonna feel some labor pains....and in these
times some innocent and not so innocent people are going to Eat the Big
Chalupa......some of us might be among them, God forbid....and this is gonna
hurt like hell while this wound is cauterized......but there can be a
positive, "strengthing" effect as an outcome. We can choose to be
proactive, not just reactive to the commonplace and growing insanity, which
didn't suddenly appear in September. The problems are as old as humanity.
But the future is out there..... the Earth, Moon and Mars are a part of our
future, and we ARE going to explore the Solar System, and develop and learn
and prosper and flourish in upcoming chapters of our history. Right?
Right! Trust me, I got a feel for these kinda things. I may not get there
with ya, but I have been to the mountain top, and I have seen the Promised
Land. It's gonna be great. "Wasn't the 70s a drag, man?".....Yeah, and
things have been dragging for quite some time, but it is all going to
change.... as it always does change....but this time, 'though, in quantum
leaps and bounds....If you think the last 50 years was full of change, wait
till you see the next 50 years.....I can't wait to watch you and your kiddos
do this new good thing (maybe I can help, too) under the navigation and
propulsion of the Wise Counselor and the Prime Mover, when we all will see
that "the Force" is a "Farce", because it was a "Face" all along....And on
that day...and it might be far into the future, but I hope not...... I will
forge my light saber into a tool to grow green critters... and into a lamp
to see well enough by so that one can walk well trodden paths in the cool of
the evening with no fear of treading upon serpents......but until then,
Tally Ho!
Sorry folks, but at this time of the year the Muse is kicking in the stalls
with all this Cyrillian Blue Sky thing going on here in Tejas with the
crisp, clear, cool weather, you see........ Gotta let him run with no
saddle or bit....every once and while. Gotta rage, rage at anything that
might corrode the batteries or cause the demise of the light saber....Ya
dig? Or maybe not. I gotta go back and read Dylan Thomas and try to reckon
what the heck he was talkin' about. Nevermind.
Oh, speaking of nevermind, I went to a big Koi show here in Tejas this
weekend and there was this wonderful, charming, Henna-haired, denim clothed
and mud-boot-clad professionally wild woman there, who was telling me a
grand story about training her Koi pets to do all manner of Pavlov-ian and
Skinner-ian things which made me laugh real hard. Kind of a Shamu-Koi thing
going on at her homestead. Anyway, she said, "You know, people say that a
fish only has 3 things in it's brain: Eating, Spawning, and Nothing", to
which my immediate response was, "Oh, yeah, that's what more than a few
women I have known have said about us men". I guess I can relate to Koi in
more ways that one, perhaps even 3 ways....Nevermind.
What can we say about the expression "Nevermind"? Is that kinda like
"satori"?
Or is it more like "sushi"? Or is it more like "clam chowder"?
Anyway........Albatross!!
Uh, do y'all have any thoughts on terrestrial applications of the
photosynthetic bacteria ala Living Machines, waste treatment streams, etc?
I do.
Keep on spinning it up.
Ted.
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| Message 34 |
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Subject: UP perch
From: "Pete and Diana Scholtens"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 16:12:28 -0700
Jim,
I've done a bit of research on perch and people have said that it's a
difficult fish to raise because they're so skittish. You may want to try an
easier cool water fish to start off with like blue gill or catfish.
Pete
Langley, BC
**********************************************
Hi
I am brand new to the list and will be building a system this coming spring.
My system will be a 750 gal rd tank with three 4x8 growing beds in a solar
heated greenhouse. If anyone knows how to build or design and uses a screen
filter for removing solids I would appreciate any suggestions pro or con. I
want to raise Yellow Perch and if anyone has any experience with this
species
in an aquaponics system I would like to find out if you were successful or
not.
I live in the beautiful Upper Peninsula of Michigan and have been raising
fish (Trout) for 32 years for the state of Michigan. 22 of those years as a
Fish Cultural Forman at a state fish hatchery in Marquette Mi. I will be
retiring in two years and would like to try and combine the two things I
enjoy most, raising fish and organic gardening.
Jim
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| Message 35 |
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Subject: Re: Adriana ref tomatos
From: "gutierrez-lagatta"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 18:21:48 -0500
Steve,
This is probably a question for Emmett or one of the tomato people on
the list. It may be "cat facing" which I believe is a nutrient
deficiency. A tremendous tomato resource on the www.gardenweb.com is
Dr. Carolyn Male, who has grown thousands of tomato varieties as part
of publishing an heirloom tomato newlsetter for many years. She posts
over on the Growing Tomatoes forum.
> But, my question is this: 90% of my tomatos are picture perfect.
But some
> otherwise perfect tomatos develop a ...(it is hard to
describe)...hard...to
> use the word "cancerous looking" growth on the bottom.
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| Message 36 |
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Subject: Re: (no subject)
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 18:41:34 -0500 (CDT)
Jim
Arlos's E-mail is:
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| Message 37 |
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Subject: RE: (no subject)
From: "Mark Allen Wells"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 18:50:50 -0500
Yes Bruce,
I am sure Arlos won't mind helping Jim out. I was going to check in
and see how Arlos is getting along anyway.
--
Jim its good to have you on the list and your expertise with fish
hatcherys will be a benefit to us all.Arlos I am sure has the
information that you seek and he will be back on the list soon He works
at the San fransisco Aquarium. Mark do you have his E-mail address handy
for Jim?
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| Message 38 |
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Subject: Re: Fw: grilling versus frying
From: "Robert Rogers"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 19:59:58 -0400
> > > Perhaps you could grill that fish, much better for your
> > cardiovascular system.
> > I was born in Hutchinson KS.
> > Bob
>
> Bob,
> Grilling works too.
> I went to an AMBUC convention in Hutch several years ago and found it to
be
> a neat little town.
> Your welcome to come by for some grilled fish too.
> Dave
> Ponca City, OK
I'm living in Louisville KY right now, trying to relocate to
Florida. I don't remember much about Hutchinson, we moved away (to Topeka)
when I was in first grade.
Hope to see some on this list in North Carolina next month.
Bob
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| Message 39 |
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Subject: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria
on Mars
From: (Bruce Schreiber)
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 19:40:05 -0500 (CDT)
Ted Its time for us to go back to our birthright from if you can believe
the oldest records of man kind is out their in space , If you read the
slavic book of Enock in the area called the maker of worlds you see the
record of this earth being Bio -tera -formed:
I will Quote it from memory ( Before the beginning out of the deep
darkness came 2 Arquahus(Ark-houses) one before the other, the first
exploded in brilliance and life so that the second might be) There are
records of 7 other inhabited planets in the Kabalic literature with the
first being called Arqua a desert planet were water is hunted but still
the original home of the Archangels.On some of the others are noted
populations that are sons of Adam 4 I think with some forgetting why
they worship but still doing it and one a jungle planet no longer doing
it altogether NOTE that these old records that predate our time by
millennia say that one of these planets has 2 suns that shine down on
the people. I could go on but I know that this talk bores folks
Bruce
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| Message 40 |
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Subject: Re: Niche markets
From: "Gene Batten"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 22:15:37 -0400
Mick,
Thanks for the input. I am usually suspicious when something is reported to
be "so easy", but there is always the hope that I might be wrong.
I must be misunderstanding something in your story below. If the local pet
store can sell ornamental tilapia, why can't you? How are they able to do
it? Could you not get a permit to raise the ornamental tilapia in addition
to your edible tilapia? Just thinking out loud. My state, North Carolina,
will probably have about the same restrictions as your state.
Assuming I (we) could get a permit to raise and sell ornamental tilapia,
about what price per fish could I expect? What size would they have to be?
How long from hatch to sale?
Best Regards,
...Gene
> Gene,
>
> I was interested in raising ornamental fish for additional profit. The
> local pet stores are selling a type of tilapia. The fish is small and
> shiny black with beautiful irridescent purple markings. I don't
> remember the complete scientific name of the fish but the word tilapia
> was part of its designation.
>
> They are selling this fish for quite a bit more than the other
> tropicals. I thought I'd buy a breeding pair and give it a try. If
> they are as easy to raise as the tilapia I have, then the profit
> potential is much greater because you don't have the time factor the
> larger tilapia have in gaining market size.
>
> I called Parks and Wildlife before I bought the fish. They said the
> fish is considered exotic and since my permits are for delivering live
> fish to food markets, it would be illegal for me to raise and sell them
> to pet stores.
>
> The other ornamental tropical fish that are easy to breed don't command
> the same selling price. I'm not saying don't do it... just maybe do
> some serious math and research before you decide to get into it.
>
> Mick
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| Message 41 |
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Subject: RE: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria on Mars
From: "Mark Allen Wells"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 21:47:45 -0500
>Mikey Dread, are you out there? How did the Carribean storm treat you?
You O.K.?
---
hey Ted,
Mikey says hello (to the group as well). I've been worried about him too.
The last I heard from him, he wasn't feeling well. I called him tonight.
It turned out to be a very nasty case of bronchitus. He hasn't been doing
anything but resting and trying to get better. He'll be around soon...
I gave him our best wishes.
---
>Uh, do y'all have any thoughts on terrestrial applications of the
photosynthetic bacteria ala Living Machines, waste treatment streams, etc?
>I do.
So do I, Ted...and if space is a place of peace and a warfree zone, then
count me in. But chances are, the political-military-industrial complex has
other plans. This is from a page on the Militarization of Space...
http://www.globalissues.org/Geopolitics/ArmsControl/Space.asp
Towards the end of 2000, the United Nations General Assembly had a vote on
a resolution called the "Prevention of Outer Space Arms Race". It was
adopted
by a recorded vote of 163 in favor to none against, with 3 abstentions. The
three that abstained were the Federated States of Micronesia, Israel and the
United States of America.
"It's politically sensitive, but it's going to happen. Some people don't
want
to hear this, and it sure isn't in vogue, but -- absolutely -- we're going
to
fight in space. We're going to fight from space and we're going to fight
into
space. That's why the U.S. has development programs in directed energy and
hit-to-kill mechanisms. We will engage terrestrial targets someday -- ships,
airplanes, land targets -- from space." --
Commander-in-Chief of U.S. Space Command, Joseph W. Ashy, in Aviation Week
and
Space Technology, August 9, 1996, quoted from Master of Space by Karl
Grossman,
Progressive Magazine, January 2000
*sigh*...is there no place sacred and free from all this where a man can
live
in harmony with all life?
>the Earth, Moon and Mars are a part of our future, and we ARE going to
explore
the Solar System, and develop and learn and prosper and flourish in upcoming
chapters of our history. Right? Right!
I hope so, ted....I truly do.
mark
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| Message 42 |
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Subject: Re: Blue poly barrels Grow Beds, and then Photosynthetic Bacteria
on Mars
From: "Chris Jeppesen"
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 20:09:33 -0700
Ted
I think I relate to koi pretty well. I come runnin when I hear the feed bucket rattle so that
would be koi and pavlov that understands me.
I've been mulling this free fish food thing around in my emty beener a while now. also playing
with some aquatic grow beds. I'm starting to think (oh that's danderous) that a fella could
grow duck weed on pig waste, rabbit dropings or even human urin and feed the duck weed to the
fish. Did I say free, well after labor and capital cost kinda like free.
My "A" project this week is a big reflector to spash more winter sun into the greenhouse for
heat and light. My brother thinks I'm nuts but i think at worst I've just eaten too much
duckweed.
Chris Jeppesen
>
>Uh, do y'all have any thoughts on terrestrial applications of the
>photosynthetic bacteria ala Living Machines, waste treatment streams, etc?
>
>I do.
>
>Keep on spinning it up.
>
>Ted.
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| Message 43 |
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Subject: Re: Home Power Magazine - Thermo-Electric-Generator (TEG)
From: Carolyn Hoagland
Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 23:57:40 -0500
Seems like people who heat with woodstoves in cold climates might have
the perfect setup for 5 months of the year. A very hot stove pipe
exiting to outside temps of below 30 degrees F. makes for a big
temperature differential.
I wonder how much heat you can apply to one of these little devices
before it melts?
Carolyn
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